Voting On The Brady Bunch In The White House

Clip: [0:00] Raise your right hand. Peter, after me. I, Michael Paul Thomas Brady, do solemnly swear that I will faithfully execute the office of the President of the United States. Okay? And, to the best of my ability, preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States, so help me God. You bet. Dave: [0:36] This is the Extra Hawk Rate Podcast, episode 535, the week of Monday, November 4th, 2024. I am pervy secret service dude, David T. Cole, and I'm here with inaugural perm, Sarah D. Bunting. Sarah: [0:54] Far out. Dave: [0:55] Safety officer, Tari Ariano. Tara: [0:57] I'll find your cat. Dave: [0:58] And soon to be resigning in disgrace, American president, Tim Grierson. Tim: [1:03] Why not Mike Brady? Why not Mike Brady? Tara: [1:10] Right in candidate. Hello. Welcome to Extra Hot Great for another week. Joining us on this wonderful question mark election day. He's a writer and a critic. You've heard with us before. It's Tim Grierson. Welcome back, Tim. Sarah: [1:26] Tim. Tim: [1:27] Hello. Thank you for having me. Happy Election Day, everybody. Dave: [1:30] Whee! Tara: [1:31] Thanks. It's a bit of a thin week for premieres. A lot of shows are just steering clear of that election coverage, which is, I guess, expected to last for several days. Rest of our lives. Yeah, for the rest of our lives. Instead of going with something current, we went with something presidential, and that something was The Brady Bunch in the White House, a TV movie in which safety monitor Bobby Brady is helping a little girl recover her lost cat from an abandoned warehouse when he finds a lottery ticket, which turns out to be a winner. The Bradys do more than anyone could reasonably expect to try to find the ticket's owner, finally deciding to cash it in. Donating the full amount to a home for homeless architects gets them an invitation to the White House just after President Randolph is looking for a new VP. Why not Mike, wonders Carol, and President Randolph agrees. Then the president is confronted with evidence of his corruption while taking the oath of office and resigns on the spot. What a beautiful world. Mike becomes president, appoints Carol his VP. Tara: [2:37] Pretty sure that's illegal, sets about applying Brady values to the entire nation, but passed over Sal Aster, Saul Rubinek, which is one way you can tell this was made in Canada, and his girlfriend Victoria Dot Webb, Reagan Pasternak, have a plan to get Mike to resign so Sal can take his place. This is a quasi-sequel to the successful The Brady Bunch movie and a very Brady sequel, which were movie movies in the 90s. As I said, this was a TV movie. It originally aired on Fox November 29, 2002. All the kids were recast. This was six years after the second movie, and they were already kind of old in the first one. But Gary Cole and Shelley Long return to play Mike and Carol. Let's do the Chen check-in. Tim, should our listeners watch The Brady Bunch in the White House? Tim: [3:23] I'm going to say no. Tara: [3:25] Sarah? Sarah: [3:26] That won't be necessary. No. Tara: [3:28] Dave? Dave: [3:29] I have to make an admission now here in front of Saturday, buddy. I've been trying not to do this for years. Oh boy, not really looking forward to this day. I've never really watched The Brady Bunch and I do really enjoy The Brady Bunch. So this weird Brady Bunch was like a little bit better than watching The Brady Bunch for me, but there are so many weird schools of comedy competing in this TV movie. And it's all very, what is it, early aughts? Tara: [3:54] Yeah, 2002. Dave: [3:55] Yeah, it shows. And overall, it's going to be a no for me as well. Tara: [4:00] Yeah, this was really bad. Let's get into it. Okay, good. Dave: [4:03] I thought I was missing a cultural touchstone after watching this. I'm like, is this not that great, right? And then all I've heard about the Pretty Bunch stuff is everybody kind of loved it, but proceed. Tara: [4:14] But you mean the movies? Dave: [4:15] I just like the general jam because I haven't really been paying attention to it. I just knew that the movies were generally, I wouldn't say well-regarded, but people look on them fondly is my impression. I think they're well-regarded. Sarah: [4:25] And then watching this. Dave: [4:26] I'm like, well, what's wrong with me and or everybody else? Tara: [4:28] Right. Well, one thing, and this is where I actually wanted to start, is that the movies were written by real comedy writers. The first one was written by ex-SNL writers Bonnie and Terry Turner, among others. And the second was credited to, among others again, Deborah Kaplan and Harry Elfant, who wrote Can't Hardly Wait and the Josie and the Pussycats movie, but I guess Fox wasn't paying movie money for the script. because this one was co-written by Lloyd J. Schwartz, whose main credit seems to be being Sherwood Schwartz's son, the creator of the Brady Bunch, Tim. Did you feel his lack of experience was evident in the final product? Tim: [5:03] Well, I don't want to take away from the director of this movie, which is Neil Israel, who is best known for directing Surf Ninjas. Tara: [5:11] Okay, sure. Tim: [5:12] That was one, and he's done a lot of TV stuff. Since Surf Ninjas, he was also one of the writers on the original Police Academy movie. Uh, so that's his, those are his bonafides. So to Dave's point, I was never a big Brady Bunch kid growing up. I just never watched it. And so I was a culturally aware of it. Um, but when the movies came out, it was actually really funny because especially at that first movie, it kind of predates like 21 Jump Street and Barbie and even like a Baywatch in terms of, Hey, we turned these into movies, but really we know the original show is actually really kind of fun. silly and cheesy and they kind of leaned into that and that's why the first movie i think It did okay, but I think it sort of surprised people because it actually kind of made fun of the Brady Bunch and put them in the world of the 90s, put their ethos in there. Tim: [6:04] Watching this, I kept thinking, they're still doing that. It's still very much the, oh, everybody hates Marsha because she's so perfect, blah, blah, blah. But there's this thing where it just feels so flat and stale by this point. And I would also say to Dave's point about different comedy worlds fighting. it very much feels like a time capsule of this is like what political and presidential humor was like in the late 90s and the early 2000s which is funny because this comes like november 2002 it's like a year after 9-11 we haven't invaded iraq yet but it feels so incredibly safe and so low stakes i kept thinking i kept thinking this movie is terrible but i wish i existed still in the era where this is how you could make political humor because it doesn't feel remotely contentious doesn't feel remotely like it's like they're like really pulling punches it's just like other than like clinton has a sex scandal there's not much you can really make fun of and so i watch it with it's like weird nostalgia not for the brady bunch but for like that political era of oh everything was great everything was not in fact great but it's it's greater than it is right now so yeah Yeah. Tara: [7:16] Sarah, you're our resident Brady historian. Did you want to respond first to Dave's shocking confession before getting into your feelings about the movie? Sarah: [7:27] Yes. I, having known David T. Cole for one and one half minutes, am absolutely floored by the revelation that he has not treated with the Brady Bunch and thinks most of it is bad. Look, the original show was not good. It was like at the very bottom of the ratings all along. They canceled it like in the middle of an episode, practically. You know, no one is under the impression that it was good. Sarah: [7:54] And that was part of what drove the Brady Bunch movies was this acknowledgement that an entire generation felt very nostalgically for this product that was kind of not great. And then, you know, maybe someone had a crush on a Brady boy like Greg, for instance. There is like an awareness among the, quote, fandom that this is not great, but this was also in a rock block of sitcoms that you watched after school. So even if you didn't think it was good, it was on. And then what the movies did was sort of like with that deep fondness for a D plus C minus property and deep knowledge of it. They made fun of most of it, but understanding that they could do the kind of people who would go to see this movie, they could make these like jokes that some of them are really deep cuts with authority, but also still have this fondness for these characters that exist out of time in the 70s in another timeline. Right. The problem with the White House thing is that now it's making jokes about the movies, jokes about the series, which is like, and it's for TV. So it's completely like it's distanced and kind of flat. Sarah: [9:09] The like the further they push some aspects of the surreal part of it, like I kind of always like that, that it's like this is this family from the 70s and everybody's wearing bell bottoms and talking about Plymouth Valiants. And that apparently is like kind of normal to the people who know them. But in this one, like Jan evidently has hallucinatory mental illness. And it's like, OK, after a while, this isn't funny anymore. So much as like upsetting. In this universe, do you still have health care? Could someone do something about that? Dave: [9:45] See, for me, the more they did it, the more I enjoyed it. Just because it was like so purposeless. It didn't drive anything. It didn't really lead to anything. It was just her slowly going mad over two hours. And I was like, all right. I mean, the mean-spirited parts of this are actually kind of my favorite ones. Like, that was definitely one of them. What's wrong with Jan? I guess everything, and she's never going to get fixed. And the other one was the start of the movie is one of the Bradys finding this lotto ticket, which sort of sets up this chain of events that makes Mike Brady president. And they're like, well, we got to find who this is. And they're like, they do some blanket L.A. with ads so that you'll come to their house and tell them what's written on the back of the ticket to claim it. But it turns out there is a guy in death row who had the ticket, who bought the ticket. And then we show him going to his death. I'm like, all right. Tara: [10:38] Yeah. Dave: [10:39] Sure, fine. But it felt like a collection of moments more than anything else at times. Like, there is a corruption at the top level storyline, kind of, but it was so 10% of what's going on in the show. Tara: [10:53] Yeah. Dave: [10:53] So it felt like you could, like, go in, have a very long snack creation process in the kitchen, come out, and you'll be fine. And it felt like because of that, it kind of felt too drifty and aimless to actually be. Sarah: [11:05] Like, memorable. Dave: [11:06] Yeah. Tara: [11:08] I mean, the movie seems to get bored of its own premise. Like the corruption thing is just one. But like when President Randolph is running away from the oath of office, he pointedly says, pardon me to Mike. And then that never comes up again. So, Tim, I wanted to talk to you because you just did a story for Cracked about the best political comedies. Talk about the missed opportunities here. Is there a way this could have been better if this was, like, more focused or it wasn't a misbegotten idea through and through? Tim: [11:37] I think it's probably just misbegotten in general. But I was actually thinking of that list I put. It was, like, 20 films. And I was thinking, what film is the closest in terms of what this movie is trying to be? And it's probably Dick, right? Like that's probably the close the Andrew Fleming film in terms of like not very bright characters thrust into the White House, put into this position, don't know exactly what they're doing. They're up against like the real world of politics and that like clash of cultures would be funny. That's probably the closest you could get. One of my big questions is. Why isn't this movie called the Brady Bunch goes to the White House? Like, isn't that just a better title? Dave: [12:17] Yeah. Tim: [12:17] Like, I'm not I'm not an executive like wizard, but it just seems like that's a better, better title than Brady Bunch in the White House. Like they go to the White House. That's a funnier title. That alone would have given me one more laugh. Tim: [12:31] I agree with Dave that that joke, by the way, about the death row prisoner is one of the best things in the movie. one of the other things i laughed at for reasons i don't entirely understand is during the oath of office when that cute boy is looking and and jan thinks that he's looking at her and he passes her a note and the note just says can you get your sister to wave at me for some reason it just made me laugh so much because it's such a direct note i really appreciate like how like direct he was i also like anytime like paintings talk on the wall like abe lincoln i'm always gonna laugh at that like just something stupid like that and he talks a lot during the film yeah so really like he does talk a lot and he also offers like some decent advice to jan i feel like my feeling is that kind of what you were saying tara there's like the movie has like three sections almost where it's like them getting the whole lottery ticket thing like for a while i was actually like wait is this the right movie because they are taking forever to actually get to the white house then they get to the white house and then it's like okay he's president blah blah blah and then it's like wait he's gonna go into a bomb shelter at the end right there's this whole other thing where by the way i am not expecting like factual accuracy from a movie called uh the brady bunch in the white house i don't think they use tubes like that to transport information around in the film. Tim: [13:56] I don't think that's how the White House, even in 2002, how it operates. My question for you all, though, and I mean this sincerely. Tara: [14:04] Yeah. Why did we do this to you? Tim: [14:06] No, no. Dave: [14:07] No refunds. Tim: [14:09] Trust me, this was a distraction I needed over the last few days. Do you think, as Tara mentioned, I don't think it's legal for the First Lady to also be Vice President, but she wins over because Congress is also like, wait a second, this seems unorthodox. She wins them over with a song. Yeah. Do you think the song is good enough to win over Congress? Because I actually think it's a decent song and I think it would actually work. Tara: [14:35] Sarah, you should go first. Sarah: [14:38] It depends on the Congress, I guess. Tim: [14:41] But I feel like it's in the spirit of the Brady Bunch songs, but it actually is a decent enough song by people being like in the realm of the TV movie world being like, OK, that's a decent enough song. I get that. Sarah: [14:54] I'll allow it. I mean, maybe like the whole vibe of not even updating the Brady's for any of these movies is this whole like God protects fools and children bubble that the family and Alice live in. So I agree that they should have made more of like what like how does this fit into actual like parliamentary and Republican process as we like small are Republican as we understand it in the US. Like, how would a genital and blemish-free personage such as Mike Brady ascend to this high office? What would that actually look like? Would there be a bomb shelter involved? And could he back in as, like, the only remaining, like, the designated survivor guy somehow? Like, that would have been interesting. Like, how would this actually happen? Tara: [15:48] Yeah. Sarah: [15:48] But the movie is not interested in that so much as what does it look like when all of the set design elements that you remember from their house are in the White House and like all the kids are for some reason sharing a bedroom even though it's the White House. Missed opportunities, I would say, but I did appreciate that they tried to get all of those like branded elements in there, including, you know, as amateur musicians, we're pretty good, right guys? It's no, it's time to change, but it was all right. Tara: [16:18] I was more amused that it was clearly taking place in like a hotel ballroom. Like we've seen the Senate. We know what it looks like. It doesn't look like that. They're just like in regular chairs in an auditorium of some kind. Sarah: [16:32] Yeah. In the Marriott in Grimsby. Yeah. Tara: [16:35] Extremely. It's extremely cheap, and I feel like we can't close our discussion of this bad piece of art without commenting on what Dave brought up in his intro, which is all of the perving on Marsha by adult male Secret Service men. There's a shot when Autumn Reeser, who plays Marsha in this movie, taking over from Christine Taylor from the movie Movies, she's running upstairs at the White House, and her skirt is so short, the actor is holding it down while she goes. like it's it's it's actually encumbering her motion and then there's stuff with like one of the girls that comes to a slumber party like has a genital piercing and that's like one of the few jokes that makes it in and then victoria this other aide who's also like maybe in the illuminati and that's another idea that they bring up and like immediately drop but she's hitting on greg like the sexual politics of this considering that the whole gag of the brady bunch is like they don't have any kind of sex is disturbing yeah. Tim: [17:36] That's by the way that's that's veronica by the way. Tara: [17:38] Thank you sorry and. Tim: [17:39] Veronica is introduced in one of the early scenes with like a slow motion like, 1980s heavy metal rock video thing. Tara: [17:46] Um i. Tim: [17:47] Think that shelly long song is good all the other songs all the rock songs in this thing are absolutely like absolutely awful. Tara: [17:54] Uh really. Tim: [17:55] Really terrible yeah Yeah, also, like, in general, I think it's kind of funny to watch a movie where they introduce this idea of, like, oh, Alice is, like, she just makes meatloaf for them. That's all that she does. And apparently she was having sex with Sam the entire time. Tara: [18:14] Right. Tim: [18:15] I defer to Sarah. Maybe that was a joke in the movies. Other movies? I don't remember it. But, like, oh, no, like, they weren't just friends. They were definitely screwing. Like, that's a thing that's, like, introduced, I feel like, in this movie. Sarah: [18:26] Yeah, no, I think that was sort of canon that every joke that they made about the cuts of meat that he was supplying to Alice, like, if you were over the age of 11, you were like, okay, got it. They're fucking good for them. Tara: [18:43] Well, hail to the chief and then a question mark. That was a thing we watched. Dave: [18:53] It is time to go around the dial. First stop is with Tara. Tara: [18:57] Abbott Elementary season four is in full swing. When I talked about it last season, my issue was it felt like it had gotten kind of toothless compared to where it started. So I'm happy to say the fourth season has gotten a lot of its edge back. In the premiere, we find out a golf course is under construction near the school, which is drawing white families to the neighborhood. And this kicks off a gentrification storyline that's going to continue in the coming episodes as well. But when the construction crew not only messes with the school's water and power, but also turns out not to be Union. Melissa has a retaliation plan that the project's lawyer, played by Matt Oberg, Kite Man himself, tries to mitigate by offering better chairs, gift cards, computers. Tara: [19:38] Ava hears Melissa talk to the guy and yells out, what are you doing? And Melissa yells back, taking bribes. And Ava yells at her to get something for Ava too. This is the kind of cynicism that I want to see in my TV about public service. Later episodes this season also gave us a very funny ringworm outbreak episode. a very judgy Halloween costume. Both of these episodes reminded me another thing Abbott Elementary does very well is show adults being rude to kids in a way that doesn't feel mean-spirited or not just too mean-spirited, I guess. It's more like the teachers and kids are colleagues and sometimes they're going to snipe at each other. The kids snipe too. It definitely goes in both directions, whether it should or not. Janine and Gregory also got together as a couple at the end of the last season. I know that was important to some people. I was not against it. But now that the writers don't have to service all of the yearning, I feel like they're free to go in different directions with the characters. And it feels like they're having more fun with it. I definitely am. Dave, if you agreed after we watched the latest episode, it is better this season than last. Dave: [20:37] Yeah, it definitely feels like it got back into its rhythm. The other two things I enjoyed is the Halloween costume of the hamster after she falls in love with the hamster against all her best intentions. A couple episodes before that. And I'm going to go on the map to say that there is no way that many people wouldn't know what Mr. DNA and the costumes that they had was Mr. DNA and the mosquito trapped in amber from Jurassic Park. Tara: [21:04] Yeah. Dave: [21:04] Instantly recognizable. So that part of it, they needed to make the costumes a lot less good in order for that storyline to actually be believable because those were like the set design or the costume people would be like, oh yeah, we can definitely do that. We'll do a really good job on that. Tara: [21:19] Yes. Dave: [21:20] Not where you needed to go on that one. But otherwise, pretty good to see. Tara: [21:23] Yeah. They didn't look like teachers on a public school teacher salary made them out of whatever they can find. I agree. Still good costumes and a funny episode though. For my plug, I'm going to shout out the Patreon feed of our sister podcast again with this. We are well into the holidays now. And so we have a mini series of Thanksgiving content coming up, including Pieces of April, which Sarah and I watched for the first time starring Miss Katie Holmes. Our second again with this bonus episode starring Patricia Clarkson acting opposite a Dawson's Creek star. Not the last, probably. And then we'll have Christmas episodes in December as well. So patreon.com slash again with this to subscribe at any level and get those bonus episodes. Dave: [22:10] All right tim what do you have for us something you've been watching recently. Tim: [22:14] Yeah especially with the election coming up and over the last few weeks especially people are like needing sort of comfort watches everybody has their own things and often they are things that are maybe a little more bite-sized people go on reels or tiktok or whatever my comfort thing for a long time and especially over the last several weeks are the criterion closet videos for people who are not familiar with these, they are on YouTube and they are put together by the Criterion Collection. Tim: [22:43] Criterion Collection is based in New York and they have a famous closet where all of their Criterion Collection films are stored. And a few years ago, several years ago now, they actually started inviting celebrities into the closet and they recorded them making selections of movies they wanted to take and then sort of talking about them. Tim: [23:03] I think Bill Hader was the first one maybe almost eight years ago something like that they become a real sort of staple now for the criterion collection where they have people now really on their press tours go when they're in new york they stop by the criterion collection they have their video done and they talk about the movies that are in the collection that they really love and the thing i really enjoy about these things they're only like five six minutes long and it's not really about the movies that they pick it's about the stories that they tell about the movies and why they mean a lot to them and it's also kind of a fun way to get celebrities to not talk about the what they're there to sort of promote and sort of talk about themselves um when carrie condon who was in uh banshees of indian sharon was there she talked about uh robert altman's mccabe mrs miller which she's never seen because and she told the story that she had a really jerky boyfriend who was really into the movie and was such a dick that she sort of refused to ever see the movie and so now she felt like it was finally time for her to watch the movie funny story like that like ben gibber the front man for death cab for cutie got very emotional talking about this documentary about uh the homeless in seattle and his wife works in that world and him talking about seeing the movie for the first time and him kind of breaking down was really sort of surprising then you've got somebody like andrew garfield who talked about his dad and his dad turning him on to movies and that all being an introduction for him talking about this movie called Tim Popo. Tim: [24:31] Which his dad always wanted him to watch and he never wanted to watch it as a kid. And he watched it recently and he realized as an adult, as a professional successful Oscar nominated actor, oh, my dad really has amazing film taste. And so you hear these like personal stories about like, these movies and what they mean to these people it's kind of like this really refreshing way to kind of like see how celebrities think uh Andrew Garfield when he was doing his said this is sort of like a confessional booth isn't it like you're really just like confessing something and that is really sort of the charm of them they're now pumping them out like maybe about once a week used to be like every two months or so and for the most part I find them still really enjoyable They're not too formulaic yet. It really is the person going in there and kind of bringing something of themselves into the experience. And occasionally they recommend good movies that maybe you haven't seen. So that has been my comfort watch of late. Dave: [25:27] I love Dan Popo. Yeah, we just watched it recently-ish. What a great movie. Sarah: [25:32] Yeah. Tim: [25:32] Yeah. And it's also like I have never seen All That Jazz. It is amazing how many times All That Jazz comes up in terms of people talking about it. Most recently, Anna Kendrick talked about it and she said, I know people in my life have probably said I should see it, but I only saw it recently. And I'm mad because it's so weird to be the age, whatever age that she is, and realize that there's this movie that's been made specifically for you that you never knew existed and stuff like that as a film lover. I feed off on that stuff. I totally love that. So, yeah. Yeah. And as far as my plug goes, I write the occasional profile for the Los Angeles Times. And recently I got to sit down with Sean Baker, the writer director for Anora, which is out in theaters now. And the thing I was really happy about is that we we knew my editor and I that we were going to that was going to profile Sean Baker. But because, first of all, he's an L.A. guy like I am, and also because he is such a big advocate of revival theaters and single screen independent theaters, I sort of pitched the idea to his people about would he want to meet up at an independent theater to do the interview? And he was totally down to do it. And so I got to spend an hour with him at Gardena Cinema. Tim: [26:51] Which I have actually never been to before. It's been around since like the 1940s and it shows revival films now. And so I got to hang out with him at like noon on a Thursday at the beginning of October. Other than a couple of people who worked at the theater, it was just me and him. And we just hung out in the theater and talked about his career, talked about Anora, which is very good. If people haven't seen it, I really recommend that. And just the fact that he has made several films now about sex workers and what keeps drawing him back to that world. Anora is about a woman who works at a strip club. And so I asked him about his first experience of ever going to a strip club. I don't think anybody has ever asked him. And so he told me that story, which was really kind of like charming. I think sort of indicated something about him as a person, which I thought was really interesting. So if people want to see my stuff in general, probably just the show notes. But if you go to whatever they're calling Twitter now, I'm at Tim Grierson. That's my pinned tweet at the moment is my Sean Baker interview. Dave: [27:59] Sarah D. Bunting. Oh, wait, Sarah, before you start, I want to say if you enjoyed the first season of The Bear and you wish there was some sort of weird Japanese analog to it, kind of will get you there. Tara: [28:10] Tanpopo will. Dave: [28:10] Yeah, yeah. Tanpopo. Yeah. Sorry. Sarah: [28:12] Yeah. No, I've seen it. I was doing some research for Extra Extra Hot Great, which is also my plug, so I'll just drop that here. If you have not joined us on the Patreon, please consider it, extrahotgreat.com slash club, to find out what I was researching. We have a great dumb time, and we would love to have you along. I got sucked right back into the middle seasons of Mad Men. It is definitely a show I burned out on at the time that it was ending, just in terms of the capital T, the discourse. So I didn't really know whether it was going to hold up when I was streaming it and A, hiding from social media and election coverage, and B. Sarah: [28:53] Trying to find a streaming show that my current foster cat, Frankie would also enjoy. He seems to like reflections on mid-century advertising. He goes right to sleep when he hears the theme. So good for all of us. And I didn't know if it was going to hold up or if it was one of those week-to-week things whose tea leaves we were all reading just until they were, ground to dust. But even when it is annoying or slow, and there are plenty of imperfect or outright bafflingly mediocre episodes, it just carries you right along. It's still beautiful to look at. It is compelling to follow along with. I had forgotten a lot of guest stars and mini plot twists along the way. It's not the most accessible in terms of the literal finding and streaming of the thing. You do, at the moment, need an AMC Plus account, but at the moment, you can grab a week's free trial and immerse yourself in Mad Men for a few days for free, and then cancel it. That is what I am doing. Death to capitalism. Sarah: [29:59] It's also kind of interesting to see which characters are consistent with our impressions from back in the day. I have to go back into my own personal archives from previously.tv to confirm this, but I think i was one of the few people who was like guys megan is not that bad and i still kind of feel like she got a raw deal both from don and from the viewers i hope that dave has that chomp sound effect handy anyway hashtag justice for calve i thought she was fine and it makes me a little sad to watch her struggle and her hairstyles are amazing this jersey girl uh has no choice but to stan and once again to the into the plug breach you can brace me for that opinion on our discord by joining the patreon and once again extrahotgreat.com slash club is that url. Dave: [30:51] All right here's what's coming up on extra extra hot great this friday it is the november force ending pool and we'll be talking about the tv show emergency exclamation point speaking about shows i used to watch when you come home from school. That was definitely a late 70s item there. We'll be talking about season two, episode seven, Fuzz Lady. Fuzz Lady. That is available to all club members. Please go to extrahotgreat.com slash club for more info and to sign up and then come back right here on EAHG Prime next week. We'll be talking about St. Dennis Medical with Stephanie Green. Clip: [31:32] Dear Mr. President, there are too many states nowadays. Please eliminate three. I am not a crackpot. On the latest episode of Taskmaster Australia, a contestant was disqualified for using chat GPT in a task. While that was the right call, this shouldn't have happened in the first place. allowing Taskmaster contestants to use AI would undermine the show's appeal by one. loses human creativity. AI solutions lack the quirky humor of personal attempts. 2. Dilutes unique personalities. AI doesn't showcase contestants' individuality. 3. Unfair advantage. Tech-savvy contestants could gain an edge. 4. Breaks. Low-tech spirit. AI contrasts with the show's simple, playful vibe. 5. Weakens viewers' connection. AI removes the relatable, DIY feel of Taskmaster. In conclusion, using AI would make the show less human, funny, and surprising. Kill all humans. laughter. Tara: [32:46] Laughter laughter laughter. Dave: [32:55] It is time for the extra hot great canon this week we got a user submission so let's hear it. Clip: [33:07] The canon tv's highest honor this is my roughly five minute submission of star trek the next Generation Season 6, Episode 15, Tapestry, a great Star Trek time travel episode and one that boldly represents transplant recipients in a way that no one has done before. Clip: [33:28] Hi everyone, I'm Ari, and I'm going to tell you about one of the best episodes of Star Trek The Next Generation. Uh-oh, it's a Q-isode. Q is a character who is fundamental to Star Trek The Next Generation. Although he only appears in eight episodes over the run of the show, he's integral to both the pilot and the finale, and he's so important to the franchise that he also appears in Star Trek Deep Space Nine, Star Trek Voyager, Star Trek Lower Decks, Star Trek Picard, and numerous novels and video games. Tapestry is a really good episode for Q as a character and for his frenemy relationship with Picard. Q is here for a very good reason, the death of Captain Jean-Luc Picard. Thirty years ago, Picard got in a fight with some Nausikens that ended with him stabbed through the chest and ultimately with an artificial heart transplant, which has failed and killed him in the present. Q wastes no time in getting to the heart, get it, of what all time travel fiction is about. Now, you're sure you have no regrets or feelings of guilt about your former life? I mean, I can't have you whining and complaining through time. For those of you keeping track at home, regret is used ten times over the course of the episode, or roughly one for every four and a half minutes. Of course, Picard agrees with Q. Different person in those days. Arrogant, undisciplined. Clip: [34:44] There's far too much ego, far too little wisdom. I was more like you. And also... If I'd been more responsible in those days, I wouldn't have needed this heart. So the omnipotent Q gives him that chance, and we cut to 30 years ago with Patrick Stewart playing Ensign Picard. Oh boy. In his past, the older, wiser, and more cautious Picard makes lots of changes to undo the regrets he can. Most importantly, he stops the fight that would lead to his injury and later death. So Q pops back in, and we're back in the present, and it's time for Picard to face the consequences of his actions. Star Trek The Next Generation is frequently a workplace drama. often an examination of the features of leadership, and regularly presents us with character studies. So when Lieutenant Junior Grade Picard shows up in Ten Forward to ask for an impromptu HR meeting with his former co-workers, now bosses, Riker and Troy, we get all three. In this meeting, he's described as basically boring. They're professional about it, but this Jean-Luc Picard is decidedly not suitable for command. So he starts to regret fixing his regrets and proclaims, I can't live out my days as that person. Clip: [35:56] That man is bereft of passion and imagination. That is not who I am. So there's Q again, who lists the chances this version of Picard never took as a result of his older self's more cautious approach. In contrast to many time-travel regret stories where the more experienced person is shown to be correct in making changes, Q makes it clear that you can't just lift choices, circumstances, or mistakes from your life a la carte. Regrets don't mean that you should have done something differently. Picard has learned this lesson and declares that he'll take all of it. Thank you. Clip: [36:37] Q gives him the chance to fix his regret regrets, and Picard finds himself in the past again, right before the fight that he avoided earlier in the episode. So he does what he did originally, in an action scene that contains many iterations of a classic Star Trek move, the surprisingly effective two-handed punch originated by Captain Kirk. So he gets stabbed, and the timeline is restored, except instead of dying on the table, Q ensures that he lives. In the denouement, Picard explains to his restored friend, Commander Riker, what he learned. There are many parts of my youth that I'm not proud of. There were loose threads, untidy parts of me that I would like to remove. But when I pulled on one of those threads, it unraveled the tapestry of my life. Clip: [37:27] Oh, that's why the episode's called Tapestry. So far, I think I've covered why this is a good Next Generation exemplar and why it's a very good time travel story and episode in general. Over the years, an informal canon rubric has emerged, and I'd like to suggest an addition to that rubric, an episode that has real-world significance or impact. In this case, Tapestry presents Captain Picard as a positive and realistic representation of someone with a transplant or, more broadly, disability or chronic illness. I can speak to this because I've had four kidney transplants and a liver transplant as a result of a rare genetic disorder. Because of the way transplants are typically portrayed in media, there's a pretty strong stigma surrounding transplant doctors as thieves or ghouls and transplant recipients as villains who made bad health decisions or as saintly victims who exist for us to learn a lesson. Just to list a few examples, we have John Locke's evil father in Lost, main villain Kilgrave in Jessica Jones who murders people for their kidneys, President Underwood in House of Cards, Alcoholic Dad Frank Gallagher in Shameless, Detective Simone on NYPD Blue. Clip: [38:34] Roughly a gazillion guest stars on Grey's Anatomy, ER, Chicago Hope, and other medical shows, not to mention whole-ass movies that have transplant shenanigans and villainy as a premise. Not to make this all about me, but I know I feel the impact of that by the fact that I needed to mention that my organ failure was caused by a genetic disorder. In addition, there have been studies done that show that the poor portrayal of transplant doctors and recipients has a chilling effect on the general public's willingness to donate organs upon their death. And, in contrast to all those other characters I listed, Picard is neither villain nor victim. Instead, he's a hero. Clip: [39:08] Representation is important, but so is accurate representation. Despite being set in the future with an artificial heart that doesn't exist yet, tapestry is an accurate portrayal of what people with all kinds of disabilities and serious health issues think about and deal with. Having regrets about the road not taken is universal, but it has extra resonance for people within the disability and chronic health community. In both this and the Season 2 episode where his heart transplant is introduced, Jean-Luc expresses deep shame in addition to regret over it, which is especially common as well. The fact that he ultimately accepts that and his full history as part of him, even potentially accepting an earlier death, is aspirational, realistic, and positive. Just as in this episode, many threads of my own life that I might prefer to pluck out are inextricably tied to things that I wouldn't. If my first transplant hadn't failed, I wouldn't have met my wife, which led me to being an avid listener of Extra Hot Great and making this candid submission. So think about that, why don't you? Does it amuse you to think of me living out the rest of my life as a dreary man? As you can see, Tapestry is an exemplary and characteristic episode of Star Trek The Next Generation, a great example of time travel fiction, and an episode of TV with real-life significance. Thank you for listening, and I hope you take a risk and induct Star Trek The Next Generation Season 6, Episode 15, Tapestry, into the canon. Tara: [40:32] Ari, thank you, especially for closing with the butterfly bandage effect of how we got here, hardy har har. Tim, you chose this from our list of submissions. Please start off our discussion. Tim: [40:44] Yeah, that was really just beautiful, I have to say. That was a really lovely case that Ari made. um and and and the personal story as well i was on board with this episode anyway, so i really fast uh i was a star trek next generation watcher when it came out um and i remember seeing this episode it was february of 1993 i was a teenager and i in general really liked the next generation but i especially liked the the card spends the hour thinking about stuff episodes i am a big fan of the episode family from a couple seasons before this one which for people who don't remember it was right after the two-part best of both worlds when he is un-borgified and he then like takes some time off to kind of like recover both mentally and physically and emotionally also from what happened in those borg episodes and he goes and hangs out with his brother and we see that other side of who picard was and this i've always thought as being sort of another episode kind of like that this one has a cue in it as re mentioned and you know i feel like so many people said enough about how great patrick stewart was sort of throughout this series but these episodes i felt like really gave him a chance to sort of suggest the depth of who picard is and was and. Tim: [42:06] And I really like, you know, not Ronald D. Moore, who's sort of, you know, one of the real heroes of Next Generation, of course, did Battlestar Galactica, which I also adore until it ran out of gas, sadly. But I loved that series as well. And I really like how Ronald D. Moore kind of digs into this idea, and Ari really kind of articulated it, the idea of that thing that we are regretting from our youth that's always been something that's been with us. And maybe if we thought about it in a different way, maybe that would change everything. I liked what Ari said about the idea of the stigma of transplants, because in movies and television shows, it is often the one thing I think he didn't mention quite as much is that if a character we discover that they had like a heart transplant or some kind of major surgery, it often is a sign of their dark past that they are trying to get away from. It's an indication to the audience, oh, they must have done some bad things. And now they're trying to make amends or they're looking for redemption in their current iteration of their lives. And Picard's heart is literally that sort of thing. It is a regret that he has what the episode is basically trying to do. and I'm really just repeating what Ari said, is to say, you know, you looked at that as a failing, but maybe it's something that you needed as a boost for who you are as a person. Tim: [43:35] I like the episode a lot. The thing I think is interesting that from watching it as a teenager versus now seeing it like near 50. Tara: [43:44] I was going to say when your guards age or they are bad. Tim: [43:47] Yeah. By the way, did I Google how old Patrick Stewart was when this episode came out? I did not because I did not want that. Tara: [43:54] Okay. Tim: [43:54] Sorry. If I'm avoiding election stuff right now, believe you me, I don't want to know that either. But I thought about watching it now and thinking, I think that the episode's point is still there, but I don't know. And this is not necessarily a criticism of the episode. It's just the way that now the age I am, I think about what this episode is about. And one of the things I thought was it's not I don't know if the premise of the episode or what Q is trying to teach him is actually accurate. I don't know if Picard would not be Picard just because this thing didn't happen. The idea about the tapestry, again, that Ari sort of talked about that Picard says at the end, everybody I think has their own opinions about these things. My feeling is that Picard's still that person and something else would have happened to him along the way that would have still made him be the Starfleet captain that we know on the show. Dave: [44:52] Future determinism in effect. Tim: [44:54] Yeah. And so it's an interesting thing to watch in the episode because I kept thinking, but maybe if Picard can go back and try to talk his friend out of not getting into this fight, maybe there's a third option. Maybe there's not, we get into a fight and I get stabbed through the heart and I'm just a wimp and I now become a wimp because of it. And it's just a TV show. It's only like 47 minutes long. but while watching the episode i kept thinking i just don't know if life actually works that way in terms of in terms of my experience and the experience i have with friends i think it speaks to how you see human nature but my feeling is that we are fundamentally kind of who we are and there are grave things that can happen to us and change the course of like our lives but i don't know if Picard's desire to find another way would have necessarily made him a wimp. So that's just my thought. That being said, I love the episode. So yeah. Dave: [45:55] Agreed. The episode's great. Here's my take on that. This is sort of Picard's Kobayashi Maru test. Tim: [46:00] Interesting. Dave: [46:01] Where Kirk had to face the no-win situation and then refused to, and then sort of couldn't deal with death later on so picard is sort of like accepting that lesson things will happen and you have to roll with the punches and yes this will make you who you are yes to everything you said but also we only have 44 minutes so let's get on with it i think it's probably the real economics of it but i totally agree with what you said i just kind of feel like this is sort of the kobayashi baru for picard and you know let's the shorthand i guess, Some other random thoughts just about the presentation and the episode that I enjoyed. I thought they did a good job casting Jean-Luc's dad. I kind of believe that that could have been the same gene pool. So well done there. The further away we get from Next Generation, the more it looks like a really super cheap hotel, like a Marriott Courtyard or something like that. Like at the time, in contrast with the original series, it looked new and shiny, much in the same way, you know, when J.J. Abrams did the Apple Store Enterprise, it looked, you know, new and shiny. But now it kind of looks ridiculous. Like who's cleaning that shit all the time? But the Dom Jot table, the bumper pool of the future table where it is just like, so they take bumper pool, they add more holes in the thing. They put LEDs in all the bumpers, and it's just like straight from the Electronics Depot store in your city. Sarah: [47:30] Yeah. Dave: [47:31] And that's the game. And then on top of that, they had these bad dudes that stabbed him named the Nausikens, and they don't even blend their masks with their face underneath anymore. It's just like, it's a different color. Like, you can kind of see where the mask is lifting away from their eyes. They're like, ah, fuck it, doesn't matter. They're playing Domja, like how ridiculous this pool table is. Nobody's going to notice the mask, how bad the pool table is. And those guys are just like one note characters, you know, which is always a little bit weird to see in Star Trek when Star Trek sort of fails that idea. And like, oh, Klingons are bad in the original series. And like Nausicaans are sort of like the same idea. Like they come in, they talk like caveman, they'll beat you, they'll stab you. Why? Because they lost a game of future pool. That sort of stuff creeps into Star Trek once in a while when it shouldn't. And then they have to sort of, with shows like Lower Decks, save that and then like show that, oh, not every Nausicaan is a jackass. Look, there's this like nice one. Star Trek likes to do that every once in a while. The parts with Q being funny are really great. The telegraph but still funny scene the day after Jean-Luc has sex with his friend in the academy. Then, of course, he rolls over in bed in the morning and is Q there. Which, by the way, they're at the head of the bed. There's a gigantic glass sculpture and a very tiny stand, which seems like Starfleet OSHA violation. It's just like something bad is going to happen. You're either going to cut yourself or knock yourself out. Tara: [49:01] Well, they're on a base, right? They're not on a ship. So maybe that makes a difference. Dave: [49:05] The only thing I didn't like about the scene was when Q and Picard are talking about what happened last night. Clip: [49:10] All her clothes fall off. Yes. And she's scrabbling around to get them back on again. But even before she can get her knickers on, I've seen everything. Dave: [49:18] I was so out of place. Boom. Tara: [49:22] Give credit where it's due. I paused the episode and said that while we were watching it. Dave: [49:26] I know, but I'm the one who cut the clip. Tara: [49:27] Okay. Dave: [49:28] Yes, that is from X-Riz. That's not from this episode. If you haven't seen the Patrick Stewart episode of Extras, the high tail there is so fucking funny. Q just gnawing down on a big leafy green because, never really explained why. This has got the world's biggest bok choy leaf or something like that going to town on it. Fantastic. Loved it. This was a great presentation, and I love the personal aspect. I've never really thought about how transplants are portrayed in pop culture, but he's absolutely right. Thank you for bringing that to my attention. All right. All right. Who wants to go next? Tar? Tara: [50:00] Um, sure, I can. Dave: [50:03] Or do you have no gramba? Tara: [50:06] I have plenty. Dave: [50:07] Plenty gramba. Tara: [50:09] I agree with you about the looking like a cheap hotel. My first note is even the sickbay blankets are spacey, like they're silver for no reason. It's dumb. They look like the capes in beauty school dropout fantasy from Greece. But I was shocked to hear Ari say Q is only in eight episodes. To me, like Q looms so large. That's really surprising. What a great character. Great performance by John Delancey, too. You know, they have a little fight when Q's like, I'm God, and then they argue about it. But, like, functionally, Q is God. I love that every episode he's in is sort of like, you know, ultimately, it's just like he thinks Jean-Luc Picard is so interesting that he goes to these lengths just to fuck with him. And, like, that's such a compliment to the character. Like, I hope Picard kind of appreciates where he's coming from with that. When we first see the scene of Jean-Luc getting stabbed, he laughs. The young version of him laughs. And then, of course, at the end of it, we see why, which is fun, but it's also sort of Bill and Ted's excellent adventure. That's a complimentary. And as to the point about the, you know, whether he would be a wimp, under what circumstances he would become the character that we see, you know, the lieutenant second grade or whatever. Tara: [51:27] Ari didn't mention it, but there's a part where after he's talked to Riker and Troy, he gets in an elevator and he's all depressed. And then Jordi gets on and is like, hey, I'm still waiting for those papers. I'd like to think that what actually happened was Picard's like, wait, someone's yelling at me. Fuck this. I'm not living in this reality where someone is in charge of me. This sucks. Dave: [51:49] Well, there was also a moment of Captain Privilege just before he gets on the turbo lift where he's sort of expecting traffic to move for him. Tara: [51:56] Right. Dave: [51:57] It's very, very subtle, but you can kind of tell it was a note on set that day. He's like, He's got to adjust his path a little bit. And it was like a minor defeat. Tara: [52:06] Yes. My last note is about Ari's points about the disability and about the way organ donation and organ transplants are portrayed. I was watching a lot of medical shows this weekend, medical comedies, in fact, and just wanted to tell Ari and everyone to look out for episodes of St. Dennis Medical because there's a very funny plot line with someone who comes from who has become a nurse after being in a very religious community and finding out like no organ donation is OK. It's not weird. In fact, it's weird if you're not an organ donor, like very positive propaganda for it there, which I think is great. The other show I watched was from a few years ago. It's called Porters, and it's about an idiot working in a hospital. It's a British sitcom who thinks that if he starts at the bottom, he'll work his way up to being a doctor, which is, you know, not how it works. But he decides to become or get tested for a kidney donation to impress a girl. And, you know, it goes about as well as you would expect. But it's still, you know, again, positive propaganda for organ donation. Everyone is, of course, you know, in the temporarily not disabled category. we will all be in the disability community at some point. So it is important that disability of all kinds is portrayed with empathy and compassion and in a way that is respectful. But having said all that, I do think this is a next level. You wouldn't hit a guy with glasses. Ending his submission by saying he's an organ recipient. I'm just kidding. Ari, you know we love you. Dave: [53:35] Not only am I an organ donor, Tara, I also had a second checkbox that says I insist, which means they will forcibly put their organs in somebody who doesn't need them if they think they're a little bit better. Tara: [53:45] Well, good for you, Dave. You're a better person than me. Great submission. Great episode. Thank you so much for bringing it to us, Sarah. Sarah: [53:52] Yes, absolutely fantastic submission and God-level guilting also. Well done. And yeah, I think another thing that I don't think anyone's mentioned yet about transplant portrayals, especially in dramas, is that there is this someone else had to die so that you could live thing, usually happening, that tends to make the proceedings very downbeat and fraught for the recipient, and I think for recipients in the viewership, but I do not know. And thank you, Ari, for sort of focusing our attention on that. This episode is what I call a way homer that you're sort of in the theater in front of the TV with your arms folded and you're like, whatever, like, get on with it. Get to the point. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a Picard. It's a wonderful. It's a Picard full life. We get it. And then you find yourself thinking about things and discussing things about it, like walking to the restaurant and then over like until the main course shows up, you're still talking about things that you thought were your issues with it. But the fact that you're still talking about it is something. Sarah: [55:02] And this worked in the same way, that despite the fact that it was a few minutes too long, I felt, and that there were certain aspects of it that I could see them coming and I was impatient with it at times, I thought that, first of all, Patrick Stewart does not read his lines as though he's in a procedural, which he basically is, but he never reads his lines like that. everything is getting the full Shakespeare treatment, and especially in something like this, you appreciate the seriousness with which he takes, not himself necessarily, but at least the work on it, so that a line reading is not what you are necessarily expecting or might get from Riker et al. The way that the metaphor of the heart and what heart can mean figuratively, that it's kindness. Sarah: [55:56] But also courage, compassion, but also the willingness to fight, and that they then hold up this rubbery thing that the props department made. And it's like, well, it's just this rubbery thing that the props department made, but then it's many other things as well, that they don't really underline that part of it in the text. And I was thinking about that for. Sarah: [56:22] Like an hour after watching this episode, that it was like, there are certain things that they are definitely like hanging little lights on along the way. And then that light is sort of like reflecting onto other things that they're not drawing your attention to. They're just kind of letting you figure it out, which you don't necessarily go into a TNG canon presentation expecting subtlety. And maybe that was like unintentional, but I appreciated about this episode also that when it did come to the uh you know pottersville it's a totally happening picard aspects of it that they like as tim referred to earlier like there are all sorts of things that could have happened on the other side of the sliding doors of these things going differently in the past but then they kind of for all mankind did it around to the same like how we ended up with fucking reagan anyway in that in that universe as well that they just decided like this is how it's gonna change this is how he can correct it and we're just not we're gonna get up over the canyon and we're not looking down until we land on the other side and i appreciate that like even if it doesn't totally hold up in terms of the prime directive or a butterfly flapping its wings or whatever like having the courage of your convictions and picking one destiny that was change to one other destiny. Sarah: [57:44] It's like, thank you. We all have things to do. Don't get bogged down in the multiverse. So I appreciated that about it. And this presentation kind of refocused me on the good parts of this and the parts of this show that despite usually feeling like it's too slow and P.S. I'm grateful there was no Wesley in this episode, that it does do some things extremely well, and not always the ones that you expect. So this was fun to watch and a delightful presentation. Guilt trip package signed off on. Let's go. Dave: [58:19] All right. Let's put this the official vote. Tim, what say you? Canon worthy or not? Tim: [58:23] Yes. Dave: [58:24] Tara? Tara: [58:24] Yes. Dave: [58:25] Sarah? Sarah: [58:26] Make it so. Dave: [58:27] Yeah, me too. So. Star Trek, The Next Generation, season six, episode 15, Tapestry. you are hereby inducted into the Extra Hot Great Cannon. Clip: [58:46] Americans love a winner. Yup. And will not tolerate a loser. Nope. Dave: [58:52] It is time to discuss the winner and loser of the week. Tara has this week's winner. Tara: [58:58] It's a co-winner. The Crown, Hax, and The Bear are all leading the nominations at the Arteos Awards, which honor outstanding casting. And I have my issues with actually all of those shows, but the casting is not among them. All of those are, I would say, exceptionally well-cast shows. And the crown, you know, for having to sort of face match people has the hardest job, but they actually got people that were good matches for the people they're playing and also good at acting. Josh O'Connor, I would say, is the standout in that category. But congratulations to all those shows. Dave: [59:31] If you love the Arteos, you should try Honey Nut Arteos. All right. Who's our loser of the week besides me for telling that joke? Sarah: [59:41] And anyone who doesn't have organ donor checked off on their driver's licenses come on you're better than jerry orbach now i don't think so actually it's prime video definitely not better than jerry orbach because uh jeff bezos can't win for losing prime video is launching ai generated tv show recaps again now and forever we urge you to leave it to the Sarah: [1:00:03] professionals the human professionals. Tara: [1:00:06] That's right. Dave: [1:00:07] That's right. Sarah: [1:00:08] Yes. Dave: [1:00:08] Speaking about leaving it to professionals, do you know what time it is? Sarah: [1:00:11] Game time. Dave: [1:00:12] It's game time. All right, everybody, it is the eighth game time of the season. The season scores are Tara has four. A win today will clinch her. The season win, Sarah's still looking to get on the board. Value guests right behind Tara with three. Today we are playing Honey, I Shrunk the Screen from Yours Truly. In today's game, I will test your knowledge of TV series adaptations of movies. I will give you the year of a movie and the year of the TV adaptation of it started. I will then give you the sixth sixth build actor from the movie name the movie here for six points if you get it wrong or you pass I will give the fifth build actor from the movie to the next player in line so everybody is playing every question today we're going to keep on going till someone answers correctly or we run out of actors you only get one guess per question so you can answer or you can pass. That's it. We'll throw it to Picky, see who is first. This will only determine who is guessing first for each round. Clip: [1:01:27] We will start with Tara. Dave: [1:01:29] All right. So the order for the whole day is going to be Tara, Tim, Sarah. So when one person gets it wrong, you're up deck. You can just throw your guess or your pass in there. So let's give you an example to figure out how this is going to work. As we go along, The movie is from 1985. The TV show is from 1994. Our sixth billed actor is Judy Aronson. Any guesses here? Tara: [1:01:57] Yes. Dave: [1:01:57] Suzanne Snyder is your fifth. Number four, Bill Paxton. Sarah: [1:02:04] Weird Science? Dave: [1:02:05] Weird Science is correct. Yes. Bill Paxton, Elon, Mitchell Smith, Kelly LeBrock, Anthony Michael Hall. Weird Science became a TV show in 94. That's how you play it. That would have been worth four points. Tara: [1:02:17] Okay. Dave: [1:02:18] All right. We've got 27 questions. No Grossworth Equalizer Challenge Zones or Steel Mills today. Are we ready to play Honey? I Shrunk the Screen. Sarah: [1:02:28] Yes. Tim: [1:02:29] Yes. Dave: [1:02:29] We're going to go Tara, then Tim, then Sarah for the whole game. So be ready with your next guess. You're not going to get a lot of time for these guesses. Tara, our first question. The movie is from 1992. The TV show is from 1997. Your sixth-billed actor is Michelle Abrams. Tara: [1:02:46] Pass. Dave: [1:02:47] To Tim. Fifth-billed, Luke Perry. Tim: [1:02:51] Pass. Dave: [1:02:52] Fourth-billed, Rudger Hauer. Sarah: [1:02:54] Rudger Hauer in Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Dave: [1:02:57] Yes, that is correct. That is a four-point answer for Sarah. To Tim. The movie is from 1942. The TV show is from 1983. The sixth billed actor is Sidney Greenstreet. Tim: [1:03:14] Maltese Falcon? Dave: [1:03:17] The fifth billed actor, Sarah, is Conrad Veidt. Sarah: [1:03:27] Casablanca? Dave: [1:03:28] Casablanca is correct. Five-point answer. Sarah, you will start off the third question. The movie from 71. The show from 73. Six-billed actor, Lawrence Pressman. Sarah: [1:03:42] MASH. Dave: [1:03:45] Fifth build, Gwen Mitchell. Clip: [1:03:47] Pass. Dave: [1:03:49] Fourth build, Christopher St. John. Tim: [1:03:53] Pass. Dave: [1:03:55] Third build, Charles Chaffee. Tara: [1:03:58] And it's back to me, right? Because Sarah's out? Because she guessed? Sarah: [1:04:02] Yeah, I guessed. So it's back to Tara. Tara: [1:04:05] Okay, pass again. Dave: [1:04:06] Moses Gunn is your second build. Clip: [1:04:10] Pass. Dave: [1:04:11] And top build is Richard Roundtree. Tara: [1:04:16] Shaft? Dave: [1:04:16] Shaft. Clip: [1:04:17] One point. Sarah: [1:04:17] We're just talking about Shaft. Dave: [1:04:20] All right. That took us to our last clue. Tara: [1:04:22] I can dig it for one point. Dave: [1:04:22] Only one point. Tara, you're starting us off. Tara: [1:04:25] Okay. Dave: [1:04:25] The movie is from 1984. The TV series is from 1986. Sixth build, Tony Edwards. Tara: [1:04:34] Pass. Dave: [1:04:36] Robert Phelan. Sarah: [1:04:38] Pass. Dave: [1:04:40] Richard Yeckel. Charles Martin Smith. Tara: [1:04:51] Revenge of the Nerds. Dave: [1:04:54] Karen Allen, Pass This is just for Sarah Last one, Jeff Bridges Starman Who played the Jeff Bridges Starman? Tara: [1:05:09] Come on Sarah, you know this Yeah, we watched it. Dave: [1:05:13] Surely you can't be serious. Sarah: [1:05:16] Oh, yeah. Robert, what's it? Dave: [1:05:18] Yeah, Robert Hayes. Sarah: [1:05:18] With the drinking problem. Hayes. Dave: [1:05:20] All right, back to Tim. We'll start us off with this movie from 70 and the TV show from 72. Your sixth billed actor is Roger Bowen. Clip: [1:05:31] Pass. Dave: [1:05:32] Your fifth billed, Robert Duvall. Sarah: [1:05:35] MASH. Clip: [1:05:37] MASH is correct. Five points. Sarah. Dave: [1:05:41] 1980 is the movie. 1982 is the TV series. Sixth build, Boyd Gaines. Sarah: [1:05:50] Oh, pass. Dave: [1:05:53] Fifth build, Antonia Franceschi. Tara: [1:05:56] Pass. Dave: [1:05:57] Fourth build, Laura Dean. Clip: [1:06:00] Pass. Dave: [1:06:02] Third build, Lee Carreri. C-U-R-R-E-R-I. Sarah: [1:06:08] Pass. Dave: [1:06:10] Second build, Irene Cara. Tara: [1:06:13] Fame. Dave: [1:06:13] Fame is good for two points. Tari, we'll start us off with this one. The movie is from 95. The series, 96. First actor is Elisa Donovan. Tara: [1:06:24] Clueless. Dave: [1:06:25] Clueless, six point answer. Yes. Sarah: [1:06:28] Good job. Dave: [1:06:29] Tim, 1980 is the film. 82 is the TV series. Sixth build, Elizabeth Wilson. Tim: [1:06:37] Pass. Dave: [1:06:38] Fifth, Sterling Hayden. Sarah: [1:06:43] Sterling hit. The Godfather Part 2. Why? Dave: [1:06:49] Fourth build, Dabney Coleman. Tara: [1:06:51] Nine to five. Dave: [1:06:52] He's only in a little bit, Taryn. You know why? Tara: [1:06:55] A little dab will do you. Dave: [1:06:56] A little dab will do you. That's right. That is worth four points. Back to Sarah. 1988 is the movie. 1990 is the TV show. Your sixth build is Philip Bosco. Bosco. Philip Bosco. Sarah: [1:07:16] Pass. Dave: [1:07:17] Fifth build, Joan Cusack. Tara: [1:07:21] Working Girl. Dave: [1:07:21] Working Girl is correct for five points. Yes, Alec Baldwin, Melanie Griffiths, Sigourney Weaver, Harrison Ford. Tara, start us off with this 1959 movie that became a 1977 TV show. Sixth build, Dick Sargent. Tara: [1:07:39] I will never get this. Pass. Dave: [1:07:42] Fifth build, Gene Evans. Tim: [1:07:44] Stalag, 17. Dave: [1:07:48] Fourth build, Dina Merrill. Clip: [1:07:52] Pass. Dave: [1:07:54] Third build, Joan O'Brien. Tara: [1:07:56] Pass. Dave: [1:07:58] Second build, Tony Curtis. First build, Cary Grant. Sarah: [1:08:10] North by Northwest? Dave: [1:08:12] Incorrect. Tim seems like he might know this now. Tim: [1:08:17] I know. It's going to drive me crazy when you tell me, though. No. Dave: [1:08:22] Operation Petticoat. Tim: [1:08:24] Oh. Sarah: [1:08:25] What? Dave: [1:08:26] Yes. Sarah: [1:08:27] Hateful. Dave: [1:08:28] Tim, you got a movie that started in 76 and a TV series that started one year later in 77. At the bottom of our list is Michael Anderson, Jr. Tim: [1:08:43] Pass. Dave: [1:08:44] Farrah Fawcett. Sarah: [1:08:48] Farrah Fawcett. Pass. Dave: [1:08:51] Roscoe Lee Brown. Tara: [1:08:53] I'm just going to go for it. Is this Logan's Run? Dave: [1:08:55] This is Logan's Run. That was a four-point answer. Nicely done. Sarah. The movie is from 88. The TV series from 2018. Penelope Milford is your first actor in the list. Sarah: [1:09:10] Penelope Milford? Dave: [1:09:11] Milford. Sarah: [1:09:15] Pass. Dave: [1:09:16] Kim Walker. Tara: [1:09:20] Planet of the Apes? Clip: [1:09:21] Shit. Dave: [1:09:22] Fourth build, Lizanne Falk. Tim: [1:09:25] What year was the movie again? Dave: [1:09:27] 88. Tara: [1:09:28] Oh, God. Wrong kid. Tim: [1:09:30] What was that name again? I'm sorry. Dave: [1:09:32] Lizanne Falk. Tim: [1:09:33] Pass. Dave: [1:09:34] Shannon Doherty. Sarah: [1:09:37] Heathers. Dave: [1:09:38] Heathers is a three-point answer for Sarah. All right, everybody's last question of the round coming at you. Tara. Yeah. Your movie is from 1987. Your TV show is from 2016. Sixth build from the movie is Darlene Love. Clip: [1:09:56] Pass. Dave: [1:09:57] Fifth build is Tom Akins. Clip: [1:10:02] Oh, no. Tara: [1:10:03] I think I got it. Tim: [1:10:06] I'll let Tara get it. Dave: [1:10:08] All right. Mitchell Ryan to Sarah. Sarah: [1:10:13] Mitchell Ryan. Dead Poets Society. Dave: [1:10:18] Third build, Gary Busey Lethal Weapon? Lethal Weapon, yes, became a series And then they lost the lead because he was a jackass Remember that whole thing? Sarah: [1:10:28] Yeah He's back Oh. Tim: [1:10:30] Good, thank goodness Tim. Dave: [1:10:32] 1995 is the movie 1998 is the series Sixth build is Ken Howard Pass, pass Alright Fifth build is the wily Wendy Gazelle, Pass Fourth build is the Diane Baker, What. Tara: [1:10:54] Was the year for the show? Dave: [1:10:56] Went from 95 for the movie To 98 for the show Okay Then pass Alright Dennis Miller. Tim: [1:11:07] Oh god, Pass. Dave: [1:11:11] Oh no Jeremy Northam, pass all right picking up probably one point with sandra bullock yeah the net the net yes all right this is the last question we'll start with sarah in the first round i have a sort of a half size round two for you after this 1994 is the movie 1997 is the tv show your first at the bottom of the list is Scott Bellis. Clip: [1:11:43] Pass. Dave: [1:11:44] Gloria Rubin. Tim: [1:11:49] Pass. Dave: [1:11:51] Is it your? Tim: [1:11:52] Sorry, it's Tara. Tara: [1:11:54] Tim's next. Dave: [1:11:55] No, Tim just likes going. Tim: [1:11:57] Tim. Dave: [1:11:58] Bruce McGill. Character actor, Bruce McGill. Tim: [1:12:02] The Firm. Dave: [1:12:04] Third build, Ron Silver. Tara: [1:12:07] I fucking should have guessed. I'm so stupid. Sarah: [1:12:10] Clear Imprison Danger? Dave: [1:12:12] Second build, Mia Sarah. Tara: [1:12:14] Time Cop. Dave: [1:12:15] Time Cop, Jean-Claude Van Damme at the top of that list. And that is round one. So let's get the scores. Tara: [1:12:24] Okay. Tim's still looking to get on the board. Tim: [1:12:27] Yes, yes. Tara: [1:12:28] Sarah has 18. I have 28. Dave: [1:12:34] Excuse me, man. Tara: [1:12:35] Sandy has some things to add. Dave: [1:12:37] Yes, my dog is here and she concurs. She's been tallying the scores and those are correct. All right, round two, we played exactly the same, but all the TV shows have different names than the movies. Tara: [1:12:49] Oh, okay. Dave: [1:12:50] The answer is the TV show. Tara: [1:12:52] Okay, okay, okay, got it. Dave: [1:12:54] Tara. Tara: [1:12:55] Yep. Dave: [1:12:56] The movie is from 1960. The TV show is from 2013. Your sixth build actor is John McIntyre. Clip: [1:13:06] Pass. Dave: [1:13:07] Your fifth build is Martin Balsam. Tim: [1:13:11] Pass. Dave: [1:13:12] Your fourth build is Janet Leigh. Sarah: [1:13:18] Oh, Psycho. Dave: [1:13:20] Psycho. Sarah: [1:13:20] Oh, no, sorry. Oh, shit. What the fuck was the name of the show? The name of the show was Base Motel. Dave: [1:13:27] Base Motel is correct. That is a four-point answer. Well done. Sarah: [1:13:31] I'm exhausted. Dave: [1:13:31] This is question 17. Tara: [1:13:33] It's pretty cool. Sarah: [1:13:34] That's pretty cool. Dave: [1:13:34] We'll start with Tim. With this 1984 movie that became a 2018 TV series, Sixth Build, getting lucky here, William Zapka. If you know, you know. If you don't, you don't. Tim: [1:13:51] My perfect streak is going to continue. Pass. Dave: [1:13:54] Fifth build. Randy, that's with two E's, not a Y. Heller. William Zabka, Randy Heller. Name the TV show. Sarah: [1:14:08] Yeah, name the TV. I mean, I can picture the TV show. Tara: [1:14:12] What's the movie? Sarah: [1:14:14] Well, the movie is Karate Kid. Tara: [1:14:17] Mm-hmm. Sarah: [1:14:18] But then the TV show is called, my mind is emptied of every phrase except sweep the leg, Johnny. Cobra guy. Tara: [1:14:29] Yes. Dave: [1:14:30] All right. Five points for that. I almost buzzed you on that. That was devastating. The key was traveling down on the keyboard. Sarah: [1:14:39] You should have probably, but I'll take it. Dave: [1:14:42] Starting us off with the next one, Sarah. 2010 is the movie. 2014 is the show. Your sixth build is John Tenney. Clip: [1:14:51] John Tenney. Sarah: [1:14:53] John Tenney. Clip: [1:14:57] Pass. Dave: [1:14:58] Charles S. Dutton. Clip: [1:15:01] Pass. Dave: [1:15:03] Adrian Palicki. Tim: [1:15:04] Would you pass? Dave: [1:15:06] Tyrese Gibson. Sarah: [1:15:10] Pass. Dave: [1:15:12] Lucas Black. Tara: [1:15:16] Oh, it hurts so much, Pass. Dave: [1:15:20] And our top build, Paul Bettany. There's no way you're going to get this, Tim. Tim: [1:15:27] You might know the movie. Dave: [1:15:28] But I doubt you're going to get the TV show. Tim: [1:15:31] He was in that I'm an angel thing. Is that what it is? Yeah. And the show is called Touched by an Angel. I don't know. Dave: [1:15:41] I'll give you a Dave point for that answer. The TV show was based on the movie Legion. Tim: [1:15:46] Legion. Dave: [1:15:46] But the TV show was called Dominion. Tara: [1:15:50] Oh, yeah. We talked about it on this fucking podcast. Sarah: [1:15:53] I got thrown off by Lucas Black and would have guessed Friday Night Lights, which it definitely wasn't. All right. Dave: [1:16:00] This is Question. Starting with Tara here. 2014 is the movie. 2023 is the TV show. Tara: [1:16:12] Sounds like it was last year. Dave: [1:16:14] Six. Yep. Six built. Well, no fool in Tara with the years. She knows the flow of time. Carson Bold. Tara: [1:16:21] Sure, pass. Dave: [1:16:23] Elizabeth Olsen. Tara: [1:16:28] Oh, fuck. Tim: [1:16:29] Elizabeth Olsen. Pass. Dave: [1:16:32] Bryan Cranston. Sarah: [1:16:37] The Judge. Dave: [1:16:40] Ken Wanatabe. Tara: [1:16:42] Monarch colon Legacy of Monsters. Dave: [1:16:45] Yes, from the movie Godzilla, the most recent U.S. version. Tara: [1:16:50] For three, right? Dave: [1:16:52] That is for three points, yes. All right, we'll start with Tim with this 1981 movie that became a 1992 TV series. Your sixth build is Denholm Elliott. We're looking for the name of the TV show. Tim: [1:17:08] Young Indiana Jones Chronicles. Dave: [1:17:11] Yes, six-point answer. Tim: [1:17:13] Nicely done. Thank God. Thank you, Denholm. Sarah: [1:17:17] Excuse me. Dave: [1:17:19] Marcus Brody there for the six points. Tara: [1:17:22] Damn. Dave: [1:17:23] Sarah, 1984 movie, 2008 TV series. First actor you're going to get is Rick Rosevich. Sarah: [1:17:35] Oh, God. Rick Rosevich in 1984. and then the TV series was in 08, nope can't pull it pass fifth. Dave: [1:17:52] Build Lance Hendrickson, pass fourth build Paul Winfield. Tim: [1:18:03] Pass. Dave: [1:18:04] All right. This one's good for Sarah. Third build, Linda Hamilton. Sarah: [1:18:10] Oh, Terminator colon, the Sarah Connor Chronicles. Dave: [1:18:13] Yes, that is good for three points. All right. Everybody's last question coming at you. Tara: [1:18:19] Starting with Tara. Dave: [1:18:21] Should we get a scores here? Let's get the scores. Wait, hang on. Tara: [1:18:24] Yeah. Dave: [1:18:24] Wait, let's get the scores. Tara: [1:18:25] Okay. Tim has six points. Sarah has 30 points. I have 31. Dave: [1:18:33] Oh, boy. Tim: [1:18:35] So how much is this last one worth? Tara: [1:18:38] Great question, Tim. Dave: [1:18:39] Six points if you can answer it correctly. Tim: [1:18:41] Oh, okay. Okay. I have a chance then. Go ahead. Dave: [1:18:45] Tara. Tara: [1:18:46] Yeah. Dave: [1:18:46] The movie is from 1974. The TV series is from 1976. Your number six actor is Harry Northup. Tara: [1:18:57] I just have to go for it. Is it The Odd Couple? All right. I'm out. Dave: [1:19:02] Fifth build, Ola Moore. Clip: [1:19:04] Pass. Dave: [1:19:06] Fourth build, Lelia Goldoni. Goldoni, probably, I guess. Sarah: [1:19:12] I'm sure that that is true. Pass. Dave: [1:19:15] Did it clear things up for you immensely? Sarah: [1:19:17] No. Dave: [1:19:17] Third build. Tara: [1:19:18] Back to Tim. Dave: [1:19:19] Billy Green Bush. Tim: [1:19:22] The movie was 74. The show is 76. Dave: [1:19:25] That's right. Tara: [1:19:25] Yes. Tim: [1:19:26] That doesn't help. Tara: [1:19:28] Sounded so authoritative. Dave: [1:19:29] Yeah. I was ready. Tara: [1:19:30] I really thought something was about to happen. Dave: [1:19:33] Finger on the ding. Second build. Alfred Lutter III. Sarah: [1:19:42] Pass. Dave: [1:19:43] All right, first build, Ellen Bernstein. Tara: [1:19:46] Oh. Tim: [1:19:49] Okay, so it's. Dave: [1:19:50] A 74 movie starring Ellen. Tara: [1:19:53] And it has a different title for the show than it did for the movie. Tim: [1:19:56] Right, so it's Alice. Dave: [1:19:59] Alice is the show from Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore. Tim: [1:20:02] The movie. Sarah: [1:20:04] Oh. Dave: [1:20:05] All right, Tim. Tim: [1:20:05] Seven points. Oh my goodness, so close. One point away. One point away. Sarah: [1:20:12] America is Spoken. Dave: [1:20:13] 1986 is the movie. 1990 is the TV show. Sixth build is Cindy Pickett. Tim: [1:20:22] Pass. Dave: [1:20:23] Fifth build, Jennifer Gray. Sarah: [1:20:27] What the hell? Dave: [1:20:29] 86 is the movie. Sarah: [1:20:31] 90 is the TV show. No, no. I mean, the movie is Ferris Bueller's Day Off. I just don't remember what they called the TV show. So I'm just going to guess that it was Ferris Bueller. Clip: [1:20:40] You are correct. Tara: [1:20:41] You're fucking right! Tim: [1:20:43] Oh, my God. Dave: [1:20:45] And you'll start us off with our last regulation question. For a movie from 1976 turned into a TV show that started in 2016. Sixth build on the movie Patrick Troughton. Sarah: [1:21:00] Oh, of the Kennebunkport Troughtons? Dave: [1:21:04] Barely. Sarah: [1:21:05] I'm glad I got to make that joke, but make a guess I cannot pass. Dave: [1:21:09] Fifth build, Harvey Stevens. Tara: [1:21:13] Pass. Dave: [1:21:14] Fourth build, Billy IE, Billy, Whitelaw. Billy Whitelaw. Third build, David Warner. Sarah: [1:21:25] Nope. Pass. Dave: [1:21:27] Second build, Lee Remick. Clip: [1:21:32] Pass. Dave: [1:21:34] First build, Gregory Peck. Sarah: [1:21:37] Mm-hmm. Dave: [1:21:40] 2016 yeah that's the series to uh 1976 is the movie i. Tim: [1:21:46] I'm drawing a complete blank. Dave: [1:21:47] Do you know what the movie is, no all right anybody know what the movie is i think sarah does it's the omen so the show is. Sarah: [1:21:57] Damien colon the omening dope, i Dave: [1:22:01] Don't know the title of the tv show is the subtitle for the second omen if that helps And that is Damien is the name of the show From Annie It's all for you Damien Us too, That is regulation Let's hear his scores Okay. Tara: [1:22:18] Tim finished with 7 I had 31 Sarah D. Bunting is our victor With 35 Nicely done Sarah D. Clip: [1:22:26] Bunting Finally gets on the board. Dave: [1:22:30] All right, two more. We'll play for shits and giggles. Tara: [1:22:33] Okay. Sarah: [1:22:33] Why not? Tara. Dave: [1:22:35] 2011 is the movie. 2015 is the TV show. Sixth build, Johnny Whitworth. Clip: [1:22:41] Pass. Dave: [1:22:42] Anna Friel. Sarah: [1:22:43] Oh, well, pass. Dave: [1:22:45] Fourth build, Andrew Howard. Tim: [1:22:49] I'm passing on Anna Friel. Dave: [1:22:50] All right. We tried to get Abby Korn. We couldn't. We got Abby Korn-ish. Tara: [1:22:57] Oh, God. Oh, is this Jack Ryan? Dave: [1:23:04] All right. Second build, Tim. Robert De Niro. Tara: [1:23:08] Oh, she was in the movie, duh. Dave: [1:23:16] 2011. Tim: [1:23:16] Pass. Dave: [1:23:17] All right, Sarah, see if you can get yourself a steel mill here. Bradley Cooper, first build. Sarah: [1:23:25] Silver Linings Playbook? Clip: [1:23:27] No, that's not correct. Sarah: [1:23:28] I don't know. Dave: [1:23:28] We're looking for Limitless. Tara: [1:23:29] Limitless. Dave: [1:23:30] All right, one more. Sarah: [1:23:31] Oh, God. Dave: [1:23:32] 1988 is the movie. 1989 is the TV show. Your sixth build, Tim, is Peter Jason. Peter Jason. Clip: [1:23:41] Pass. Dave: [1:23:42] Leslie Bivis. B-E-V-I-S. Sarah: [1:23:46] Let's call the whole thing off. Pass. Dave: [1:23:49] Kevin Major Howard. Clip: [1:23:51] Pass. Dave: [1:23:52] Terrence Stamp. Tim: [1:23:56] Pass Mandy Patinkin. Sarah: [1:23:59] Priscilla Queen of the Desert James Caan. Tara: [1:24:06] Um, was there a Tron show? Clip: [1:24:10] Is this Tron Duck Rollerball? Dave: [1:24:12] No, this is Alien Nation. Tara: [1:24:15] Alien Nation. Tim: [1:24:16] Alien Nation! Dave: [1:24:18] All right, so no steel mills for you. Sarah: [1:24:23] No. Dave: [1:24:24] And that is it for this episode of Extra Hot Great. We followed the Brady Bunch to the highest office in the land before going around the dial with stops at Abbott Elementary, the Criterion Closet, and Mad Men. Dave explains sort of why he's not a crackpot for insisting on a total ban of AI from Taskmaster, Ari transplanted Star Trek The Next Generation's tapestry into the canon, we crowned winners and losers of the week, and Sarah was the winner of this week's Game Time from yours truly. Next up is the November 4th inning pool on Extra Extra Hot Great, and come back here next week for St. Dennis Medical. Clip: [1:25:05] Remember, We're listening. Dave: [1:25:10] I am David T. Cole, and on behalf of Tara Ariano. Tara: [1:25:14] They named a president after your school? Dave: [1:25:17] Sarah D. Bunting. Sarah: [1:25:19] Whining and complaining through time. Dave: [1:25:22] And Tim Grierson. Tim: [1:25:24] Pardon me. I mean, pardon me. Dave: [1:25:26] Thanks for listening. We'll see you next time, right here on Extra Hot Crate. Clip: [1:25:35] This just in, ABS has projected the winners, incumbent President Randolph and his running mate Mike Brady. Apparently, the result was decided in favor of Randolph and Brady thanks to a heretofore untapped coalition of former Boy Scouts, disco music lovers, and polyester enthusiasts. Sarah: [1:25:56] Ha ha ha ha!