Putting On Rose-Colored Glasses For Elle

Clip 00:00 We have something important we want to talk to you about. Oh god. Is this about Marlena? Which one's Marlena? It's days of our lives Dave 00:18 This is the Extra Extra Hot Great Podcast. Episode 418 for the July 4th, 2026 weekend. I am the second worst thing that happened to Nirvana, David T. Cole, and I'm here with Archival Cosmo, Sarah D. Bunting. Sarah 00:37 Hello, use the gloves Dave 00:39 And botch nose job, Tara Ariano. Tara 00:41 It's social suicide. Welcome to Extra Extra Hot Great for another weekend. Dear Plub members, this is the podcast that only exists because of you. Thank you so much for your support. We love you We are here to talk about Elle. We all know Elle Woods is a sorority president and fashion merchandising grad, turned Harvard Law School valedictorian, as we all saw in the documentary Legally Blonde. But La School wasn't the first challenge Elle ever had to overcome. In Elle, the titular character, now played by Lexi Mindree. finds out that because of a nose job her father Wyatt, Tom Everett Scott, botched, he and the family are going to have to flee LA post scandal forcing Elle to do at least her junior year of high school somewhere with a lower volume of cosmetic surgery, Seattle, Washington. And it's nineteen ninety five, so Elle is gonna have to try to make her way in what is firmly the Grunge Era. The show was adapted from the movie and from Amanda Brown's novel before it by Laura Kittrell, formerly a producer on Insecure and the Tegan and Sarah bio series High School. Prime Video renewed L for season two in January months before its full series premiere on July first. We got act Access to all eight episodes and we may talk about events from any of them. Let's do the Chen check-in. Sarah, should our listeners watch L? Sarah 02:17 I'm not going to, but I'm not gonna stand in front of a screen to prevent anyone else from doing it. Good natured, but no for me. Dave 02:26 They were bringing the tropes you wanted to see in a way that you're familiar with with confidence and competency. Tara 02:33 Yes. Dave 02:33 So I would say if you feel like you want to watch it, you probably do. Tara 02:36 I think this is a fine it's not for adults. It is a show for teenagers, so If you have a teenager, this might be a fun show to watch with them. But if you're going to watch by yourself, I think it's a little thin in the same way that Wednesday is. This is sort of like Inside Out Wednesday, kind of. Sarah 02:52 Mm-hmm. Dave 02:55 Right. Tara 02:56 Let's get into it. Am I the only person here who has seen Legally Blonde? Dave, I don't think you have. Dave 03:01 No, I have seen it and I think maybe you I've saw it with you, but don't remember anything about it. Tara 03:04 Okay. Dave 03:06 Or maybe I saw Legally Blonde 2 without seeing the first one. I couldn't tell ya Tara 03:09 I'm not sure. Dave 03:10 But that was one of the things I was puzzled about was in my mind, Legally Blonde is about a character that previous to the lessons learned in Legally Blonde was sort of this vapid jerky character. Tara 03:12 Uh huh Well, that's the thing. Dave 03:24 Yeah. Tara 03:24 That's the problem with a prequel. Dave 03:25 And I didn't get that impression from L that that character is the same character as described in Legally Blonde. Tara 03:26 Anyways Sarah, have you seen the movie? Sarah 03:32 Yeah, no. Tara 03:34 Okay. Yeah, that's the issue with the concept of the prequel. It's like The movie is a very high concept, dipshit learns a lesson sort of thing. I mean, she's not a bad person, she just is very superficial. And then she goes to law school to like prove to her boyfriend who dumps her that she can do it and she's worthy of him marrying instead of like a Vanderbilt who his older brother is engaged to. And then it turns out that she has an aptitude for the law and she wins a case by knowing about how perms work. Spoiler. Dave 04:06 Is that is that what it was? Tara 04:07 Yes. Dave 04:07 Okay. All right. Tara 04:09 She busts Linda Cardellini's alibi for a murder by saying, you know, if you had had a a perm that day, you couldn't have been in the shower when the murder happened, because you can't get your hair wet for twenty four hours after you've had a perm Dave 04:12 Okay. Tara 04:21 So unfortunately a show about a high school junior who goes on this journey doesn't get made, though, I guess, without an IP tie-in, whether it fundamentally makes sense or not. But like having seen the whole season Like it takes her back to her obsession with Cosmo, like that's part of it. There's a contest that she enters in. I won't spoil the whole thing, but like it sort of deposits her at the end of Legally Blond mentally, but then I guess we're supposed to think like she just forgot all that and decided to go into fashion merchandising in college anyway. So that's that's my issue with the show. And what would actually make more sense is a clueless sequel since Sherer is already from nineteen ninety-five, but I s but they did this instead. Sarah 04:58 I thank you. Yeah Like not knowing anything about Legally Blonde except the premise, because I didn't see it somehow, despite the fact that it was definitely like it's been on cable every weekend for a quarter century, probably Tara 05:14 It's cute, and for anyone who does want to watch it, it is on Prime Video. Proceed. Sarah 05:18 Yeah, but and like Lexi Mind Tree is cute, very winning. I think it's well cast, it's fine, but I was getting such strong clueless vibes that it's like, why should I spend more time on this when I already have clueless the movie memorized? I was also thinking like, why did this idea work for me with the Carrie Diaries when that Carrie was much more like felicity than like the carry that we knew from Sex in the City. And I think you just have to kind of assume canonically that in a prequel it's a sliding doors. situation, but just like going the other direction in time, if that makes any sense. Tara 05:59 Mm-hmm, yeah. Sarah 06:01 The dog is cute. No no notes on the dog ever, but it's like It's just not necessary. On the other hand, it's not for me. It's not aimed at me. Tara 06:11 Mm-hmm. Sarah 06:11 So it's fine. It's not a bad time. There's nothing about it that's like badly done Dave 06:17 Where are we in fashionable retro stuff? Is this currently what all the Gen Zers are doing on TikTok? Is it Nirvana and Grunge and Tara 06:26 I I mean I hear that they're into like a sort of pre-tech era. Dave 06:30 Yeah, sure. Tara 06:31 That's that's what appeals to them, so Sarah 06:32 Mm-hmm. Dave 06:33 Well, ninety ninety five is is pre-internet, so I mean commercial internet, yeah. Tara 06:36 Yeah, more or less. It yeah, yes. Dave 06:39 Yeah. Tara 06:40 The other thing that the other difference between this and the Carrie Diaries versus Sex in the City is that like in that case the difference is 20 years. or so. Sarah 06:47 Yeah. Tara 06:48 And here it's like 1995 to 2001, which is when the movie comes out is like nothing. Like going from your junior year to the end of college is no time at all, really. Sarah 06:58 Yeah. Tara 06:59 That also I think makes it harder to buy in, as it were. Dave 07:01 Yeah. Sarah 07:02 Mm-hmm. Dave 07:02 But I mean I think the ambitions of this show the blonde ambitions are Sarah 07:07 Yeah. Dave 07:08 Here is some familiar comfort food for people that enjoy this thing. It's sort of like a YA novel in that way, I think. Tara 07:16 Yeah, mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Dave 07:16 It's just Remember the things you liked? Sarah 07:17 Mm-hmm. Dave 07:18 Here's some more of it. It's not going to challenge you, but it's competently made with good performances, so you don't feel bad about watching it either alone or with your teenage child. Tara 07:21 Yeah Mm-hmm. Dave 07:30 And I just feel like that's the goal and I feel they achieved that. Tara 07:33 Yeah Dave 07:33 It's not high television, it's not prestige television, but I think it's doing its job. And there were some funny moments. Sarah 07:39 Yeah. Dave 07:40 My favorite part of at least the first episode was they moved from LA to Seattle because the dad fucked up some plastic surgery and asked skedaddle out of town with his tail tucked between his legs Tara 07:52 Mm Dave 07:52 The mother just redid Elle's bedroom in her house to be all pink and red and glitzy. And she just starts breaking down Elle does because she had a really shitty first day at school. And the mother's like, what's wrong? What's wrong? Do y don't you like it? And she just cries, I love it. And then the mother says, Does your face know you love it? And I was like, that's good. Tara 08:11 Yes. Dave 08:12 And there's moments like that, like every once in a while you get a good joke like that amongst all the Tara 08:13 Yeah. Mhm. Yeah Dave 08:17 beats that you expect from this sort of story. Like the first thing she does at school to win over the boy, you know, like helps him she helps him with the auction that's not going well and that sort of thing. So I just think it's like it's all expected, but I don't think you're gonna have a bad time watching it. Tara 08:32 Mm-hmm. Yeah, her her mother's played by um June Diane Rayfield as well, and she is really, really funny, steals all her scenes. Sarah 08:35 Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Dave 08:38 Yeah. Sarah 08:40 So good. They didn't have Taibow here yet was a was a really good line. Tara 08:44 Yeah. Yes. So uh to tease you for what's y more to come, the auction on behalf of the underpaid support staff, that ends up being a bigger story. Dave 08:54 Right. Tara 08:55 It goes places Dave 08:55 Backs backfires, yeah. Sarah 08:57 Mm Tara 08:57 I'll just say it goes places. There's interesting intrigue that goes with that beyond the surface level. Dave 09:02 Okay. Tara 09:04 We do get to see the botch nose job eventually, so that's a good payoff for that as well. I also think they did a good job with the needle drops too. The the music is well chosen and it is Sarah 09:17 Mm-hmm Tara 09:18 it it's uh time appropriate. They also made a few references where I was like, I don't know if that was then and then I looked it up and was like, oh okay, like Brad Pitt and Gwyneth Altra were dating at this time. Like my bad. Sarah 09:28 Oh my God, Clinton's America, shit Tara 09:29 You looked it up Yeah, yes. You know, we give the Apple credits sequences shit all the time 'cause they deserve it. I feel like I do need to say this show's credits are on theme, they're visually interesting, and they are efficiently explanatory of what the show is about. Like it's sort of You get a shot of Elle doing things that's all pink and her poppy music and stuff, and then it alternates shots with Seattle people play painting their nails black and shopping for Nirvana albums and blah blah blah. Dave 09:57 Yeah, I thought what they should have done is that sort of thing, but it should have been from the shitty camcorders at the time. It should have been live instead of all computer animated. Tara 10:03 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Yeah, that would be cute. Dave 10:07 Yeah. Because like in the first episode, her friend group back in LA, one of them just got a a car phone and she's got like one and a half minutes a month to spend on it. Tara 10:18 Yeah Dave 10:18 The second time she L calls her, it's like I use up my minutes, call me in twenty-eight days. Tara 10:22 In twenty seven days, yeah. Sarah 10:24 Yeah, leave a message and I'll call you back in 28 days. Dave 10:24 Yeah. Yeah. Sarah 10:27 That was good. Tara 10:28 I was also impressed. That there's a whole thing in the first episode about like we're reading much-adoo about nothing and then it never comes up again. They don't do the thing where it parallels what they're what is happening in the storyline, which I appreciate it. But I also like that the like the sort of crisis event is moving in the middle of high school. Like that's something that for a teenager would be a crisis. And, you know, stuff gets heightened from there, but I thought, like, okay, this is like this is a smart place to start. Sarah 10:49 Yeah. Tara 10:54 Even if the reason that it happens this way is because you had to shoot in Vancouver, I assume. Sarah 10:55 Mm-hmm. Dave 10:59 Yeah, right. Yeah. And Elle's reaction to it wasn't cartoony Resistance. It was sort of like I know I can do nothing about it because I am a teenager and I have to go where my parents go because I need shelter and food. Tara 11:08 Yeah Dave 11:12 So that part I appreciated too. It wasn't too over the top like you can get in some of these things. Tara 11:17 Yeah. Dave 11:17 Yeah. It was well considered, I thought. Tara 11:19 Mm-hmm. It's cute, there's just not that much Say about it. Dave 11:22 No. Tara 11:23 Like once you get over my big issue with like should this exist in this form, you can just accept that it does and pretend, despite the references to it, that like legally blonde doesn't exist. Dave 11:33 Yeah, also the human condition, same argument. You know a human condition I like. The one where I'm just listening to this all day. Mmm, let a wash over you. It's the theme to Ask EHG.all right, let's get into it. We're skipping right to your questions. First one from Johnny Assay Is ponies a worst title or is Terriers the worst title? Or perhaps Cougar Town? Or perhaps from? Yes, this was about 17 questions combined into one. Tara 12:23 Well, in our timeline, Ponies has just been canceled after one season, which I would say makes it exactly as bad a title as Terriers was. Dave 12:26 Yeah. Tara 12:33 They both lasted the exact same length of time, Sarah. Sarah 12:37 No, like ponies indicated what it was about, right? Persons of no interest. Tara 12:43 Mm-hmm. Sarah 12:43 Terriers had nothing to do with anything I mean in terms of functionality of title from best to worst ponies cougar town from and terriers from is like ungoogleable but that's a different conversation Dave Tara 12:56 Right Dave 12:57 I would say ponies is equally as bad as Terrier's, insofar that it is an animal name that doesn't tell Cekent what the show is about. Yes, it does mean something, but you have to watch the show in order to understand what ponies is. Tara 13:12 Mm-hmm. Dave 13:12 Perhaps if it was ponies with like the nineteen seventies Daryl or Chomps treatment where it's actually an acronym with little dots in between everything. Sarah 13:19 Oh, gotcha. Dave 13:21 That would be dumb, but ponies should have been called something like Moscow Queens or something like that, you know, like and the the theme is Rasputin or something like that. Sarah 13:21 Yeah. Tara 13:22 Yeah, yeah. Dave 13:31 Like Just to situate you in place at the very least, like, or introduce something about spy craft or sorry, excuse me, tradecraft. Cougar town at least has the town part of it, right. Tara 13:42 All right. Dave 13:42 And from is the most meaningless of them all. Obviously, it's inscrutable, smells pretentious, unsearchable. So. Rube Goldberg, which of your five senses is the strongest? Sarah? Sarah 13:55 Hearing Dave Dave 13:57 Outrage, Tara Tara 14:00 I realize the preposterousness of saying this while I'm wearing glasses, but they are just reading glasses. It is so I don't get headaches. I think my eyesight is still very strong. Dave 14:09 All right. Tim for a crossover podcast question. What is your favorite Billy Joel song? I assume he's talking about Mark and Sarah talking about songs. Sarah 14:19 I hope so. Dave 14:19 I got two. For storytelling, I'm gonna go with Scenes from Italian Restaurant, which I have extracted countless jokes from. Sarah 14:24 Yep. Yep. Dave 14:27 For what I'm calling keycraft TM, I'm going with Prelude, the start to Angry Young Man with the crazy piano work. Tara 14:36 Everybody loves you now, Sarah. Sarah 14:38 Travel and prayer Dave 14:39 Gosh, deep cut. Diatho, what's your all-time favorite prime time block? Ooh, tar. Tara 14:47 Just because of the fond memories of watching it together live, Survivor slash CSI slash whatever was after that without a trace, I think. That was like you know the afterthought but survivor in CSI in those early 2000s when Dave and I were uh when my sister was living with Dave and me that was fun that was appointment TV for all of us Dave 15:07 I'm not quite sure how to chop this up because there was lots of sort of overlapping deals with the 2005 HBO Sundays lineup, but check out this powerhouse lineup. Sarah 15:15 Oh, it's a Dave 15:17 Deadwood, six feet under. Entourage. The comeback, Rome, Curb, Extras, Sopranos, and Big Love all the same year in that block. Sarah 15:24 Wow. Tara 15:25 Yeah. Dave 15:25 I mean, that's you know, that's like the fabled year in nineteen eighties. film with ET and everything happening, it's sort of like the TV equivalent of that, like so many all timers all in one year. Sarah 15:31 Mm Dave 15:36 Sarah. Sarah 15:37 I actually should just throw my weight behind Dave's, but what I actually answered was NBC's 95-96 Friday night lineup. Bunt nip. Unsolved Mysteries at 8. Dateline at 9. Homicide Life on the Street at 10. Tara 15:53 Fuck, yeah. Sarah 15:54 Sometimes Dave 15:55 That is yes, that is Sarah Bunting DNA. Tara 15:57 That's pretty good. Dave 15:59 L Triple B, what is your most memorable bathroom wall graffiti? Sarah. Sarah 16:05 When my brother and I used to co-run his rehearsal space King Killer Studios in uh Giannis, Brooklyn. There were some real dialogues that were happening in Sharpie, but the one that always stuck with me is that someone made a little checklist with like check boxes and there's one square next to it says gun and then in the next square it says cannoli. Took me a few taking a couple whizzes before it was like, oh Dave 16:30 A couple whizzes. Sarah 16:32 Yeah. Dave 16:32 Yeah, that's a great measure of time. Sarah 16:34 Dude Dave 16:35 Alright, this is very Canadian, but I saw many variations of this growing up in the 70s and 80s, uh, back home before I stopped pooping outside of home base. The first message would read Jesus saves, and then the second message would read something like Gretzky picks up the rebound, he shoots, he scores. Tara 16:52 Nice Sarah 16:54 Yeah. Yeah. Dave 16:55 Dan Cassino, I was re-watching early in treatment episodes and was reminded how terrible Gabriel Burns' character is at his job. Which TV psychiatrist, counselor, or therapist has the best track record of actually helping people, Tara? Tara 17:10 I went with Dr. Orna Guralnik from Couples Therapy, and I don't think it's close, Sarah. Sarah 17:17 I really don't think it is either. I didn't take that one because I technically haven't watched that show, and more I was struck by how almost uniformly bad or at best mediocre so many television therapists are and the less said about Dr. Phil the better. Tara 17:32 Oh God, yeah. Sarah 17:33 I'm just gonna give it to Adrian Monk's psychiatrists. both of them, but we'll give the formal W to Hector Elizondo's Nevin Bell, since Monk made the most progress towards the end of the series. But yeah, they're all pretty bad. Even Melfi. Sorry, girl. Dave 17:51 Seth, inspired by from, and when we say from, we're talking about the TV show from, please rename a show with a new awful title while maintaining a connection to the program's identity. I'm changing 30 Rock to Live Exclamation Point. Sarah 18:06 Sex in the City is now Carrie, with all that that implies. Tara Tara 18:11 Getting on is now sort oldest to newest. Dave 18:17 L Triple B, what's a good example of a minor character moving into the foreground of a TV show? So minor to major character. Tara 18:26 I went with Donna on parks and recreation. I mean she's a secondary character, but she moved from tertiary to secondary and I loved her, Sarah. Sarah 18:33 I thought you were gonna say Donna from Beverly Hills Dine of 210, and I was like, yeah, I guess technically. That's what happened. My actual example is Spike from Buffy the Vampire Slayer. I mean, it's a good example of the of it happening, but it's not necessarily good. Like he I think overstayed his majority, but anyway. Can't be undone. Dave. Dave 18:53 I got a few. The first thought was Saul Goodman and Mike from Breaking Bad. Sarah 18:57 Sure. Dave 18:58 After watching the one episode of the Tessamus, I watch Aunt Lydia probably, right? Sarah 19:03 Mm-hmm. Dave 19:03 Was she sort of a minor character that and now she is doing all that stuff in her second show? Tara 19:03 Mm-hmm. Yes. Mm-hmm. Dave 19:08 The Fawns originally was not part of the main cast, was just some dude hits two boxes when he's angry. Sarah 19:12 No. Dave 19:15 And uh from Taxi uh Lacka from Taxi, I mean, ugh, but Tara 19:18 Mm-hmm. Sarah 19:18 Mm. I mean, yeah, but classic and the uh subtype. Dave 19:23 L Triple B has another question for us. Watching the floor. Do you think Fox has a plan if the player's territory took an unfortunate shape? So it's like a disco floor and you get squares. Tara 19:34 Mm-hmm. Dave 19:34 It's like a pixel board. Tara 19:35 Right. Dave 19:35 So Sarah, what happens? Sarah 19:37 I don't know the show that well, except for this part of the premise, but if someone's territory starts to look like a penis, They should sub in a category about famous mistakes and blunders, call it boners, and put it near the tip. Dave. Dave 19:53 I think they should just absolutely run with it and just like pixelate the whole board when they're playing and then hope it becomes a viral hit for a little while and actually get people to learn about the show, which I don't think many people do. Tara 20:07 Do I think Fox has a plan if a player's territory took an unfortunate shape? No, I don't. Dave 20:12 Okay, fair enough. Sam the Beagle What's the one song that you can guarantee will get me moving? Tara 20:16 Mm-hmm. Dave 20:21 This is one that's on my iTunes that whatever it pops up, it happens. That is One Mint Julep by Ray Charles, produced or arranged by Quincy Jones from 1960. Tara 20:55 Mm-hmm. I did not clip it, but I think everyone knows what it sounds like. It is Hey Yah by Outcast. Sarah. Sarah 21:02 Solid choices both. I went with September by Earth, Wind, and Fire. Dave 21:07 Elspeth has our last question. What piece of media would be hilariously improved by adding at least one Furby into the mix? Tara, Furbanize. Tara 21:16 Yeah, well we talked about it last week and it is the yelliest show I could think of. It's gonna be the bear, so in the middle of a some kind of screaming fight in the background, a Furby is gonna join in. Dave. Dave 21:28 Uh the Tribbles episode of Star Trek, the original series, or the Blood Eagle episode of Vikings, where the guy Tara 21:34 Ha Dave 21:35 His innards are ripped out and his skin looks like wings and all shit, and there's like a Furby right at the base just saying shit. I'd watch it. Tara 21:41 Mm-hmm. Dave 21:42 Sarah. Sarah 21:43 Ergmann's the seventh seal. Death is actually four Furbees in a cloak. Dave 21:48 All right, here comes your ask ask EHG question to answer on our Discord or on the episode page for this. Jovial Gent asks, what is the show you feel portrayed love the most realistically? Got an answer for that? Go to our Discord or our website and plop your answer there. We'll be back soon with judgment. It is time for the Extra Hot Great Tiny Canada presenting this week, closing the loop at Sarody Bunting. Sarah 22:15 Indeed. So a few weeks back, I tried to get Law and Order Season 1, Episode 6, into the Grown-ups Table Canon. It didn't work out, and I think that decision is fair and correct. Not least because that's one of those episodes with a collection of tiny canon potentials that taken together doesn't quite rise to the level of canonical proper But on the plus side, since it's not in the main cannon and since one of the line deliveries in the episode is one of my favorites in the entire series, now I can try to get Michael Moriarty's stricken, oh my god, into the tiny cannon. In case you don't recall my mini pitch from Extra Hot Great 619, here's the relevant portion, clip one. Clip 22:58 And finally, there's Moriarty's horrified line delivery when it becomes clear Scalesi is gonna get greased for wearing a wire, clip six. I'm not wearing radios. What? You can't hide the wires. This guy's not going to the park. Oh my god. Dave 23:15 So funny Clip 23:15 Me opening the fridge to see we're out of Pepsi Zero Sugar. Oh my God! Me hearing the first drops of a rainstorm and realizing I left the car windows open. Oh my god! Me saying that a cat is about to barf on electronics and it's too late to move her. Oh my god. This is always how it's pronounced. This is only how it's pronounced. Dave 23:38 Still funny. Sarah 23:38 Fucking A self from a couple weeks ago. Bouriardi's Benstone got written off the show because Moriarty seems to have gone around the bend and out of sight psychiatrically, but Stone's unflagging dungeon from the mothership's inaugural seasons is eternal, never more so than in that oh my god And I hope you'll give that fact the force of law by adding this line delivery to the extra, extra hock rate, Tiny Canon. Tara 24:05 Thank you, Sarah. I mean, I don't have much to add. I believe I was the one in the episode who said, now you can pitch that for the tiny cannon, and here we are. So obviously I've Sarah 24:12 Yep. Tara 24:13 tipped my hand, but I'll just say that this was supposed to be the pilot, as you said when we were presented the full episode. It really draws a thick line under what kind of character Ben Stone is going to be in this world And that, oh my god, is definitely part of his DNA as a character. So I think it's very important and very funny. Dave. Dave 24:34 Well, I appreciate you closing the loop on this one. I do think it should be in the tiny candid. And I said how much I enjoyed in the full one, so I'm just gonna say absolutely 100%. Let's put this to the vote. Tara. Tara 24:45 Yeah Dave 24:45 Me too. So Clip 24:48 Oh, my God. Dave 24:49 From law and order, you're hereby inducted into the Extra Hot Great tiny line delivery cannon! Clip 24:57 One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven. Dave 25:06 We are bringing you our not quite top 11 list. I will go first with the not quite top 21. Asian TV shows with Doctor in the title arranged in order of how likely they will be successfully saving your life solely based on the title from Worst to Best. Here we go! Psycho Doctor! Doctor Prisoner! Bull Doctor! Doctor Slump! Ghost Doctor Doctor Eggs Doctor Carr Mad little Doctor Mad little Doctor Doctor Strangeur Sleeping Doctor Uh oh Tara 25:36 Oh Dave 25:49 Doctor Climax, Night Doctor, Mr. Doctor, Dr. Romantic, Dr. Lawyer Dr. Storks, who delivers babies and in his free time is a concert pianist under the name Baby. Dr. Princess, Dr. X, she's sexy and doesn't play fair Dr. Detective and the one you want, Dr. Miracle. Tara 26:17 Wow. Sarah 26:17 Yeah Tara 26:18 Yep, you're right. Dave 26:19 Sarah D. Bunting. Sarah 26:20 Here are not quite 11 other formidable lady attorneys of television in alphabetical order by last name. Let's begin with Honey Chandler from Pop Gene Cusimano from The Sopranos, we only ever see her once, but that delivery of Fielder Is It is Zero degrees, Kelvin. Still respect that. Eleanor Frutt from the Practice. Amy Gray from Judging Amy. We never saw her lawyering, but she must have known how to do it. Branda Hobbs from Sex in the City if you need to feel good about picking cake out of the trash. Diane Lockhart from the Goodwife slash Fighterverse. Danielle Melnick and her bulletproof hairstyle from the Law and Order verse, Rhonda Perlman from The Wire, nobody pulled as good of Colleague Tayl as Rhonda, Bless Her Heart Grace Van Owen from LA Law, and finally Kim Wexler from Better Call Saul. Tara 27:21 Nice. Sarah 27:21 Tara. Tara 27:22 Well, we didn't talk about him much, but in the series premiere of L Elle is gifted bruiser as a Chihuahua puppy by her mother to um, you know, smooth over the trauma of having to move cities. And so I have brought the panel the not quite top 11 list of places on my property that I would photograph Bruiser the Chihuahua puppy from L. Counting down from least to most intense need to photograph the puppy there. Number ten. Underneath a piece of wall art we have that's in the shape of a very large cowboy hat. I would hold Bruiser up underneath it so it looks like he's wearing a great big hat Number nine, on the middle shelf of Dave's kitchen coffee cart. Number eight, in a cactus in our yard. Number seven, in a pile of throw pillows. Number six, in an antique fridge in our yard. Don't worry, we don't have children, so there's no punky brewster danger from this fridge, I promise. Sarah 28:16 Would it be called would it be captioned Punky Bruiser? Tara 28:20 Yes, it would. Number five, walking on our treadmill. Number four, in a salad bowl, number three, in a pasta bowl, number two, riding on Sandy's back, and number one in my cleavage. Thank you very much. Dave 28:40 Where'd the dog go? Big boobs Tara 28:47 Yeah. Dave 28:49 All right, it's time for extra credit. This week I am asking everybody to provide five shows that respectively meet each of the five goals in Maslow's hierarchy of needs. How that fits in is entirely up to each of you. There is no common metric here. Shall we do one level at a time? Go around the horn? Yes, we shall. First level at the bottom of the pyramid that you usually see the illustration for these things is physiological needs. You've got food, water, sex, shelter, sleeping, pooping is one of those, so fantastic. Tara 29:23 Mm-hmm. Yeah Dave 29:25 So Sarah D. Bunting, start us off. What are your TV shows that will meet your physiological needs? Sarah 29:31 Probably a cop-out, but I'm gonna pick sleep from that list and recommend Prohibition, the three-part miniseries from PBS, or really any Ken Burns adjacent narrator, will get this job done. Peter Coyote in this case, but John Chancellor, McCullough also works. In the wee hours, if I can't get to sleep or get back to sleep, even if I don't drop off right away, it just takes the edge off to look at old pan and scan black and white photos and listen to Peter Coyote intoning about the Folstead Act. So that is my recommendation. Tara. Tara 30:07 I went with a couple of these. Breathing, I would love to know what anyone picked for that one. But in terms of food, supermarket sweep, the Leslie Jones version, RIP, I miss it still, and of course House hunters. Gotta have a place to live. Dave. Dave 30:21 Hmm, yeah, breathing. I would love to hear suggestions for that too. I think the Walking Dead covers like almost all of these. Tara 30:27 Yeah, it's true Dave 30:28 Ditto yellow jackets, I guess. Sarah 30:28 Yeah, yeah. Dave 30:30 Similar sort of situation. Sarah 30:31 Yeah Dave 30:32 But for some reason, and this delights me, I had a cake boss to list. Don't know why. Alright, our second level is safety needs. So things that you do to improve your lot in life as far as your physiological needs. Employment taking care of your body, gathering resources, making sure your health is good, gaining property, that sort of things So it is the mechanisms by which you secure your physiological needs, I guess. That's how I'm reading it. Sarah. Sarah 31:03 I read it in a more figurative way, and I really struggled with this level of the pyramid, but in the end, I went with the Cop shows of Sally Wainwright. So you're Happy Valley, you're Scott and Bailey, because eventually the arc of these universes does bend towards justice. It does take a while, there are myriad sinkholes of human frailty, but Wainwright characters aren't copagandist sunshine PR versions of law enforcement. They feel like characters first and jobs second and they're recognizable like legibly familiar types because they're tough but flawed women. with other priorities that they also handle the viewer feels safer with investigations in their hands. I don't know if that makes sense, but A Sarah Winchester character will fight for me, and watching that on screen does give me a sense of safety and security in the sense and justice of the world. Tara. Tara 31:59 I had a similar interpretation, so I went with shows that are going to teach you how to be safe in terms of your body, secure the safety of your body. So America's Most Wanted, it's gonna tell you who to avoid very intensely. Sarah 32:12 Mm-hmm. Tara 32:15 And also along similar lines, the VAW, the Nexium cult. Documentary on HBO is going to tell you how to protect uh your body from volleyball being forced upon you and, you know, just in general, to avoid people that wish you ill. Sarah 32:21 Mm-hmm. Tara 32:31 Dave. Dave 32:31 I read it as doing what you need to do to secure your personal safety. So I think this is more of a selfish level of the pyramid. Tara 32:39 mm Dave 32:39 So for my shows for this, I was thinking Peaky Blinders. They are out for themselves and all they want to do is make sure that they have all the money and power that they can muster so they can control their fate, which I think is sort of what we're getting at here. Tara 32:53 See you here Dave 32:54 So with that in mind, I'm also going to add in 1 KB, a thousand blows, which is basically the same show, but with boxing. Tara 32:59 Mm-hmm. Dave 33:01 And I'll add to that the Mandalorian, which is sort of the same thing. Sarah 33:02 Mm-hmm. Oh, okay. Dave 33:06 Third level is love and social needs, sense of belonging, family, friends, that sort of thing. So you're not lonely anymore. Sarah. Sarah 33:16 The Golden Girls, modeled found family decades before that term was common parlance, uh, not to mention modeling sex positivity, which I think qualifies in this level of the pyramid. And on a meta level, it also works for me because it reminds me of happy, quiet Saturday nights, babysitting, quote unquote, for my brother. Eating stofers pizzas in front of the TV, half reading a magazine. It just reads home to me along a couple of axes. So Golden Girls. Dave 33:47 This is unrelated. But you talking about Stofer's pizza just reminding me about there's a divide in our time and I think it was somewhere in the aughts where they finally cracked how to make frozen pizza crust actually crunchy and not a soggy mess But the stofers are definitely in the soggy mess era, right? Sarah 34:02 Mm-hmm. Tara 34:06 Yeah. Dave 34:06 Crust wise? Sarah 34:06 No. Dave 34:07 No? Tara 34:07 Oh Sarah 34:07 Those were in the would rip the shit out of the roof of your mouth no matter what you did. Dave 34:11 Oh, okay. Sarah 34:12 Era. Dave 34:12 All right. Well we've come a long way, pizza wise. Tar Tara 34:15 Yeah, that takes me back to when we lived in Hawaii and there was no pizza delivery, and we would get emergency pizzas from the grocery store, which was in the Safeway family. Dave 34:22 Yeah. Yeah, they turn into molten lava. Tara 34:25 Oh my god, yes. Dave 34:26 Yeah. Sarah 34:26 Uh Tara 34:27 Anyway, to answer this question, love and belonging. Well, I I mean the Mandalorian I think fits here too. Dave 34:32 Sure. Tara 34:32 It's also about found family. Dave 34:33 Mm hmm. Tara 34:34 But my actual pick is The Fosters, which covers all these. Sarah 34:38 Oh wow, yeah Tara 34:38 This is a free form show about lesbian wives. I believe they get married in the course of the show because the law changed while it was on, but they also are foster parents to a number of different children, some of them biologically related. There's a pair of twins and some of them not. And Unfortunately, as always happens in these cases, it is TV, and two of the foster siblings did get it on, so sexual intimacy was in there as well, for good or ill, the fosters. Dave 35:07 Hmm. Tara 35:07 Dave. Dave 35:08 My good example for found family and friends is Brooklyn nine nine. I think that fits the bill. Sarah 35:13 Mm-hmm. Tara 35:14 Yep. Dave 35:15 And then I have three bad examples. Sarah 35:18 Uh oh. Dave 35:18 Succession, arrest development, and the sopranos. Tara 35:19 Oh yeah. Yep Sarah 35:21 Yeah Tara 35:23 Yeah, yep. Sarah 35:23 Oof, yes, woof Dave 35:26 Our second last level is esteem needs, both self-esteem and getting esteem from others, is how it's defined. So Sarah D. Bunting, the show that speaks to the esteem level. Sarah 35:38 This is one of those once it popped into my head it would not make room for other possibles answers but hoarders because I do feel good about myself comparatively that I'm staying on top of Tara 35:50 Mm-hmm. Sarah 35:53 Various households, bills paid, mold not visible, rodents defeated, at least separately And uh, you know, Dr. Robin Zazio might still need a hot oil wherever she finds herself today, but her you, a complete mess, are still worthy of love and investment of time. Tambre is the definition of uh uplifting, inspiring space um or aspirational tone. Tara. Tara 36:20 Sure. Well, in triangle that we see in data source material w what is specifically laid out in terms of esteem is self-esteem, confidence, achievement, respect of others, respect by others, and I don't know What else glow is about, if not all of those things? Achievement, certainly. We get to see people building their skills over the course of it. Building self esteem, especially Debbie, when she has to remake herself from a soap actress to mother to dominating in the ring. you know, respecting one another is is what the whole project is about, I feel. So do I love to bring up glow all the time? Yes. Does it fit here? Sarah 37:00 Mm-hmm. Tara 37:00 Also yes. Dave. Dave 37:02 My choice here is Mad Men for Peggy Olson's journey, both for self-esteem and finally getting some recognition by others. Tara 37:06 Mm-hmm. Sarah 37:06 Yeah, good choice. Dave 37:11 Our last level at the tippy top of the pyramid is self-actualization needs, the desire to be all that you can be, including partner acquisition, parenting, developing talents and abilities, and pursuing other goals. Sarah 37:25 I went with my so-called life on this one because you see that happening with bits and starts on two tracks for the kids that are our main characters and protagonists and then also for the parents, Secret MVP Patty Chase. And it's not just because there's an episode that literally is called Self Esteem, but discovering the show and feeling like I had been let into a secret club. Discovering the listserv and being able to kind of actualize myself as a TV critic slash commentator by honing my responses, striving for exactitude. It's why I'm talking to you right now. It's why I've had this career. It's why I know Tara. It's why I'm on the internet at all. And the creator is one of a handful of fellow graduates of my university who isn't so embarrassing that I let people think I went to Trenton State. So that is the actualization both of myself and of the characters and of the concept of like a one-season wonder cult show. It it defined so many things for so many people in this cultural space. Tara. Tara 38:29 Well I guess first of all I'm gonna plug Again With Again With This, where we're recapping my so-called life Again With This podcast. com slash club. My answer is also about a young person learning about the world and himself, and it's I'm a Virgo, where Cootie Sarah 38:37 Mm-hmm Tara 38:45 gets to journey from being very sheltered, having an extremely limited version of the world, to understanding how he can be part of a community and also along the way learning about material conditions and how capitalism works and how it's bullshit and um how to protect people from its worst offenses. So uh that's mine, Dave. Dave 39:08 I thought the good place fit the bill, but it was too on the nose. Tara 39:12 Yeah. Dave 39:13 I also thought Atlanta was a good example of this. Tara 39:15 Mm mm. Sarah 39:16 Ooh good pick. Dave 39:16 The arc you know across the whole series. Tara 39:18 Totally Dave 39:19 But I'm gonna go with, and I think we all know where this is going, the South Korean comic adaptation of Chicken Nugget. Sarah 39:19 Yep Dave 39:26 If you have been turned into a chicken nugget, This series tells you to be the best chicken nugget you can be. Tara 39:34 Yep. Dave 39:34 Surround yourself with loving friends and family. Embrace your new chicken-y life chicken nugget. Well, guys, that is it for this episode of Extra Extra Hot Great. We bedazzled our Nirvana shirts to discuss the legally blonde prequel series L before answering your burning ask E A S G questions like What's your favorite primetime block and what happens when there's a dick on the floor? Sarah made it official of Law and Orders. Oh my God! Induction into the Tiny line delivery cannon. We gave you three he says as he puts two fingers up on Zoom. Top not quite top eleven lists, and wrap it all up with an examination of Maslow's hierarchy of TV needs. Next up is the commercial pitchman draft two on EHG Prime. I put two up that time. I should have put three. That would have sealed the joke circle. Remember. Clip 40:30 We're listening. Dave 40:33 I am David T. Cole on behalf of Tara Ariano and Sarah Dunting. Tara 40:37 I'm only happy when it rains. Sarah 40:40 I thought Dave was a jerk, but he's just British. Dave 40:43 Thanks for listening, and we'll see you next time right here on Extra Extra Hot Great. Clip 41:01 Not bad. Yeah, well it looks like I'm not as shallow as you thought. I never said you were shallow. Out loud This is Extra Hot Great Minis. Today's topic is empathy for shitheads. Uh nationally ranked shithead Sarah D. Bunting here, uh presenting an extra credit topic from at KLN Donnelly, who asks if you could convince folks to watch one show to Teach them empathy. What show do you go with? Leah, start us off. Well, this was difficult for me because I don't watch a lot of non-reality TV and everybody in reality TV is a piece of shit. So they're Really not great examples, but I went with United Shades of America because it's the show about subculture uh well W. Kamout Bell does his show on CNN about subcultures within the United States. And while I'm not suggesting that anyone will will empathize with the KKK, it's an interesting perspective that he brings. Um and it also shows hopefully that The closed-minded will gain perspective from people being pushed out of Portland from gentrification or groups trying to keep their culture and values together like the episode in Alaska. All right. Sarah. I went with Friday Night Lights because it ha always did a good job. I mean, whatever, season two soap Manslaughter plot accepted, of showing all the sides of various issues that were realistic and was not condescending to I mean it didn't make football like It took football seriously without taking itself too seriously. Um it took its characters very seriously and obviously cared about and empathized with its um characters, even blowhard jackholes like Buddy was a very nuanced look at small town life that wasn't condescending. It sort of fooled you into thinking that it was a glossy drama thanks to Connie Britton's beautiful hair. But it had a lot to say about community and families and the struggles that we all have to empathize with one another every day. Tara. Mine is I mentioned it in my Canon presentation in our main podcast this week, but high maintenance. Um when I presented the finale and of that one I thought one of the things it does well is is present New York specifically as as a place where people have a lot of empathy and care and respect. um for one another. And I think that's something that a lot of people who maybe need empathy lessons don't credit coastal elites with having. But it also I I think it just It does a good job of having a care a character, the dude who's the weed dealer in the show, just moving through all kinds of different people's lives and meeting them. wherever they are and accepting whatever their journey is, and I think that's a lovely thing to watch and important to learn. Dave I have two answers. My first immediate answer was Mr. Rogers Neighborhood. Mm-hmm. Um and I'm gonna make a lateral move, a very similar show about a man who thinks the better of everyone, kind in the face of complaints Friend to animals Postman Pat Postman Pat Postman Pat and his black and white cat postman Pat from the UK you might not know it, but it's a uh old uh claymation or stop motion cartoon, just like Figgle Rock's a cartoon. Um about a guy who delivers uh mail for the Royal Mail and just like you know goes through sleepy villages and Sees little problems and helps people and he was always driving around. He keeps his cat in the front seat with them and uh But here's the little twist, guys. Maybe he's only being that way because he knows the UK is the most heavily surveyed Western democracy and he's just playing nice. Biding his time Well, sleep's out